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Post by Lady Frost on May 31, 2014 17:11:17 GMT -5
Another line of thinking in regards to wanting reasons to loot "things" that aren't graves (heck maybe even -are- graves) inside a crypt could be that other adventurers have died in there and their things have been gathered and collected into places or containers by either undead or their masters. I know Zoe's inventory would vastly cover even the necropolis just on its own. Here is a way for Paladins and other goodly sorts to justify taking things.
As I said before, be creative and come up with a reason your PC is doing something. Find a way that makes sense to justify it, IC.
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Post by StabbingNirvana on May 31, 2014 20:50:01 GMT -5
My argument is that paladins and other lawful good characters are justified in looting what is found in an undead creatures lair, because the grave stops functioning as a grave, hence it isn't grave robbing. That would be my in character response were someone to force that RP on me.
On the other hand, my other argument is that at the same time, for those that still do consider it grave robbing, that the action could be considered OOC because in the end, it is also a mechanical loot system for the game.
On the other, other hand for those that are pulling the elitist RP card, there needs to be a suspension of belief just as that suspension of belief is granted for other things in the game, namely the things I mentioned earlier like killing the same mobs over and over and looting the same places over and over for just two examples.
Basically, my point is let the players decide how they want to deal with a situation instead of forcing it on them. If someone isn't emphasizing or RPing out the looting of a grave, dont call the guy a grave robber.
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Post by Lady Frost on May 31, 2014 21:23:39 GMT -5
My argument is that paladins and other lawful good characters are justified in looting what is found in an undead creatures lair, because the grave stops functioning as a grave, hence it isn't grave robbing. That would be my in character response were someone to force that RP on me. On the other hand, my other argument is that at the same time, for those that still do consider it grave robbing, that the action could be considered OOC because in the end, it is also a mechanical loot system for the game. On the other, other hand for those that are pulling the elitist RP card, there needs to be a suspension of belief just as that suspension of belief is granted for other things in the game, namely the things I mentioned earlier like killing the same mobs over and over and looting the same places over and over for just two examples. Basically, my point is let the players decide how they want to deal with a situation instead of forcing it on them. If someone isn't emphasizing or RPing out the looting of a grave, dont call the guy a grave robber. That's like me telling the elves not to force their RP on me by being mad that my PC killed the elven spirits in the Hullack because it was targetable and she deserves the XP because it was there. |
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2014 21:33:13 GMT -5
My argument is that paladins and other lawful good characters are justified in looting what is found in an undead creatures lair, because the grave stops functioning as a grave, hence it isn't grave robbing. That would be my in character response were someone to force that RP on me. On the other hand, my other argument is that at the same time, for those that still do consider it grave robbing, that the action could be considered OOC because in the end, it is also a mechanical loot system for the game. On the other, other hand for those that are pulling the elitist RP card, there needs to be a suspension of belief just as that suspension of belief is granted for other things in the game, namely the things I mentioned earlier like killing the same mobs over and over and looting the same places over and over for just two examples. Basically, my point is let the players decide how they want to deal with a situation instead of forcing it on them. If someone isn't emphasizing or RPing out the looting of a grave, dont call the guy a grave robber. That's like me telling the elves not to force their RP on me by being mad that my PC killed the elven spirits in the Hullack because it was targetable and she deserves the XP because it was there. I don't mean to be overly brief, but for simplicity sake, you are simultaneously crossing the OOC/IC line by relating this OOC discussion to IC response of doing something in the game and crossing RP that affects no one else with RP that does affect others. Your analogy doesn't quite make it on both counts, both at the same time. |
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Post by StabbingNirvana on May 31, 2014 23:43:59 GMT -5
Frost, there was a while ago when all the villagers in town started attacking the PCs. Vel had to kill a good amount of folk in Suzail. Surprise surprise, I wouldn't have role played that as legitimately happening, though I now do fear for my character's reputation were Zodika to see it happening.
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Post by Lokarn on Jun 1, 2014 1:13:07 GMT -5
Frost, there was a while ago when all the villagers in town started attacking the PCs. Vel had to kill a good amount of folk in Suzail. Surprise surprise, I wouldn't have role played that as legitimately happening, though I now do fear for my character's reputation were Zodika to see it happening. Really? You think that bringing up an obvious code problem with the game is even a valid point? Are you incapable of adult level rationale? Sane people are capable of distinguishing between an issue with the game, and a player ignoring the fact that they are choosing to loot graves. I can't tell if you're purposely arguing like a child or if you're just insane. You use failed logic to justify your own personal greed to try to tell us that looting is an out of character activity. It simply isn't. Munroe even gave you an actual justifiable reason to loot graves, and still you use childish arguments to try to make some point that just makes no sense. The only thing your PC does that is OOC are things that he is actually forced to do, such as kill NPCs because they are buggy and given the wrong faction. Not because you want to loot the graves in the crypt because it's MOAR LEEWT! I know this is going to sound mean. DM's can delete it if it's too much for their liking. |
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Post by StabbingNirvana on Jun 1, 2014 1:19:28 GMT -5
That was an example of taking everything happening on the screen as legitimately happening. I find the loot system as an issue with the game, hence why I distinguish it as an OOC action. Unfortunately, that issue with the game is necessary for me to progress my character by gaining equipment and supplies that will push me to the next phase of my character's development. I dont want to believe my character is walking around looting bone containers gathering gold while strolling by. Unfortunately though, I'm forced to.
There are times when I RP "collecting the spoils". But God knows I'm not doing retarded *chickenwing* like RPing looting every pile of *chickenwing* I find on the ground.
In short, dictate your own RP. Dont dictate mine.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2014 6:59:56 GMT -5
SN, I'm curious what you mean by, "I find the loot system as an issue with the game." There's more than one way I could interpret that. What exactly do you mean?
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Post by Extropy on Jun 1, 2014 13:14:30 GMT -5
That was an example of taking everything happening on the screen as legitimately happening. I find the loot system as an issue with the game, hence why I distinguish it as an OOC action. Unfortunately, that issue with the game is necessary for me to progress my character by gaining equipment and supplies that will push me to the next phase of my character's development. I dont want to believe my character is walking around looting bone containers gathering gold while strolling by. Unfortunately though, I'm forced to. As previously mentioned, there are bugs/inconsistencies. You should try to roll with them if you can come up with something creative. If you have a mosquito drop a halberd, that's an obvious bug that you should ignore (and report so it can be dealt with). The fact that a bug exists in some loot table, or that there are some implementations that you don't agree with is not a solid basis for treating all treasure as OOC. Like the rest of combat, treasure should be considered IC in the absence of a bug. If you think some dungeons require looting things that your character would not loot, let me know the specific dungeon and we can look at that dungeon as we refresh areas for the new treasure system. There are times when I RP "collecting the spoils". But God knows I'm not doing retarded *chickenwing* like RPing looting every pile of *chickenwing* I find on the ground. In short, dictate your own RP. Dont dictate mine. Actively typing something about a loot placeable is a great way to add flavor to an adventure, but that's not what the issue is. Even if you do not type something when you loot, you are making an IC decision and an action that should be consistent with your character. While no one wants to dicate rp, the rules exist to give us all common framework. For example: 5) Do your utmost to stay in character at all times.It doesn't say, do everything you can unless you could get extra gold or xp by behaving OOC. Sometimes RPing a character with tons of restrictions like a Paladin is hassle, but it also comes with tons of benefits, both crunchy and fluffy. |
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Post by StabbingNirvana on Jun 1, 2014 22:07:01 GMT -5
Suspending belief on...
-hundreds upon hundreds of gold laying by the wayside of roads (I looted about 500gp out of 2 containers earlier today)
-killing the same named/unique boss mobs
-instant transportation caravans
-re-emerging loot in the same dungeons
-the Crown doing little to nothing
-6 day to night cycles in a single day
... Are ok.
The line is drawn when it comes to looting though. Got it. I think I'll continue doing things how I've been doing it for quite a while now and suspending belief where I see fit.
As for doing the "utmost to stay in character at all times", I have to accept that the ridiculous placement of loot and its respawning is to be taken with a grain of salt.
This is something we wont agree on. Though I am very interested in what the benefits of playing a paladin are on the server if you can maybe PM them to me.
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Post by Razgriz on Jun 1, 2014 23:37:24 GMT -5
"Playing a paladin IS THE benefit  " |
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Post by Extropy on Jun 2, 2014 0:20:45 GMT -5
SN, I think you're missing your opportunity to give actual interesting feedback & help improve the experience. I'm willing to entertain changes if you will provide concrete & constructive examples - rather than just making vague generalities and being dismissive & negative.
Hopefully you have experienced the benefits of a Paladin by now. I think I mentioned the highlights from a crunch perspective a few posts up. The fluff benefits vary by order, but are generally pretty obvious.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2014 6:13:26 GMT -5
Though I am very interested in what the benefits of playing a paladin are on the server if you can maybe PM them to me. SN, I've spent about two and a half years playing a paladin on another server that was very role play intensive, so since you've brought up the benefits of playing a paladin, I'd like to take a moment to say what I think are the benefits of playing one. - Having an opportunity through role play to demonstrate the ability to act rightly at all times, with no gaps, regardless of the level of temptation to do wrong or to fail to act rightly. - Having the chance to wrestle with moral questions in an environment of "no real life consequence," since it's happening in a game. - Having a chance to learn more about the nature of right and wrong and one's own views on it through simulation while playing. - Having a front row seat to watch the life of a character who I admire and respect as a person for her righteousness, boldness, compassion, courage, mercy, and strength, and for her human weakness and frailty and how she manages it in the context of the high calling of being a paladin. - Having the opportunity to at times portray the foregoing of material advantages like gold, magic weapons, magic armor, fame, public acclaim, political influence, magical power, and other such things in order to avoid the distraction and vulnerability they can cause for someone pursuing a deeply spiritual path. - Having a chance to portray the deep love of others that ought to pervade everything a person who is so deeply connected to heavenly forces does and says, at all times, even when angry, tired, lonely, frightened, hurt, or in any other emotional state. - Having a chance to show through the character what it is to sacrifice for what you care about. - Having a chance to portray what it is to submit one's own will to the pursuit of a cause and a calling that is greater than oneself, and to put oneself wholeheartedly into it as a permanent life choice. Of course, if one really wants to be shallow and miss the point entirely, there's always the buffs, saves, special abilities, and prestige of being able to claim to be a paladin in good standing with the authorities of heaven, too. If you ask me, these are *some* of the benefits of playing a paladin. |
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Post by venicia on Jul 8, 2024 11:04:20 GMT -5
I know this is an ancient post but here's a question... How to you get to remove it? There seems to be no path of redemption available. NPC Clerics of Kelemvor won't even talk to you, and according to what i read here, no amount of donation to the church will suffice.
Whatever the ooc or rp reasons for obtaining the mark is... some players would want to rp wiht it.. some would not. Specially if it was a mistake aquiring the mark. So, is there actually an in game mechanic that allow you to get rid of this mark in one way or another?
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Post by DM Flash on Jul 8, 2024 12:55:30 GMT -5
I know this is an ancient post but here's a question... How to you get to remove it? There seems to be no path of redemption available. NPC Clerics of Kelemvor won't even talk to you, and according to what i read here, no amount of donation to the church will suffice. Whatever the ooc or rp reasons for obtaining the mark is... some players would want to rp wiht it.. some would not. Specially if it was a mistake aquiring the mark. So, is there actually an in game mechanic that allow you to get rid of this mark in one way or another? Hello Venicia, You are correct that there is no in-game solution available to players who receive the Graverobber Token, and some players choose to roll with it while others seek out redemption. The DM Team has, and will provide RP opportunities to characters who wish to cleanse themselves of Kelemvors Curse and generally comes with a cost (i.e. time, gold, and/or other resources at the DMs discretion). Players may send a PM via the forums to me/us, or submit a #general-request ticket on Discord. - DM Flash |
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