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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2014 4:54:37 GMT -5
^^ Sounds like every archaeologist the world has ever known is an evilly aligned graverobber. And here I thought all my friends were generous, kindhearted people who would give you the proverbial shirt off their back. I guess I should develop my paladin's powers of discernment so I can see the truth in these matters.  |
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Post by Lokarn on May 28, 2014 20:32:52 GMT -5
^^ Sounds like every archaeologist the world has ever known is an evilly aligned graverobber. And here I thought all my friends were generous, kindhearted people who would give you the proverbial shirt off their back. I guess I should develop my paladin's powers of discernment so I can see the truth in these matters. I'll bite, even though you're derailing the thread, and this argument has nothing to do with NwN or D&D at all. Not to mention you're being hyperbolic, I hope. Are you saying it's ok to dig up the graves of your great grand parents take their things and display them to anyone who wishes to pay someone from another "more educated" country for the sake of learning? How about your grand parents, or your parents? How far back would it take for you to be fine with your neighbor digging up your family members for the sake of taking any thing that might be of value? I'd bet if someone had asked Ramses II if it'd be alright in 100 years, 1,000 years, or 100,000 years for his grave to be rummaged through for his valuables he'd have a negative response. The entire point of burying the dead is for it to be permanent. Not once in my recollection have I heard of a culture who thinks digging up their family members is a good thing. Just because it's interesting, or profitable doesn't mean it's right. So, yea, all archaeologists who intentionally dig up graves with the intent to remove the corpse, or items of value are indeed grave robbers. I disagree that all of them are, as some deal with buried civilizations, or any number of other things related to uncovering lost history and lore of our world. I also distinguish a huge difference between people buried in a ritual, from those who died randomly and have not been buried ritually. I think most reasonable people would see an important difference between the two. |
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Post by Lady Frost on May 29, 2014 3:19:37 GMT -5
Anyone know that one hole in the ground container that when you click on it, it ends up being a lootable place that also functions as the outhouse for the monsters? When things glow under tab, the assumption is to click on it. What about treasure island? You click tab and an invisible loot spot glows where you pick up pirate treaure. Glowing means click it. Things that glow are generally points of interest, the way to interact is clicking. Maybe -your- assumption is to just click it. Mine is to think about what it might represent, why my PC would interact with it, and finally /would/ my PC interact with it. The grave robber token even requires two clicks. If you've become conditioned to simply run around and click anything that glows and take everything you find, maybe you need a break because, in my opinion, you're doing you PC a disservice by not thinking for him and it may extend to circumstances outside just looting. |
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Post by StabbingNirvana on May 29, 2014 4:07:24 GMT -5
How did you find the treasure on treasure island, frost?
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Post by maeglhachel on May 29, 2014 4:16:28 GMT -5
"Just because it's interesting, or profitable doesn't mean it's right."
Hmm, let's focus on taking things from a grave, not the dead. That doesn't seem a matter of doing the right thing or not as much as being socially accepted or not (though one may argue that's _always_ what doing the right thing means, though esp. given D&D's alignment dual-axis I'm inclined to disagree.) In this case, however, I feel like the social acceptance aspect is esp. strong. If you're from a culture where putting things in graves is common an widely regarded as sensible and meaningful, you'll probably say taking stuff from graves is a no-go. If you from a culture where the whole idea makes people scratch their heads and go "why do it?" then you'll prolly take a different view.
And that kind of relativity would make it hard for me as a player to think of it as something along the good-evil axis, even if the sources explicitly said so. And that's why I kinda feel FRC is doing it just right, right now.
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Post by Lady Frost on May 29, 2014 4:52:11 GMT -5
How did you find the treasure on treasure island, frost? My character knew she was looking for treasure, so when I saw a place to target, I decided that my PC would interact with it because it makes sense that treasure could be in the ground. I clicked on it to represent my character interacting (digging). It turns out treasure was there. There was a clear, IC, thought process behind it. |
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Post by Ivarcles on May 29, 2014 6:28:06 GMT -5
How did you find the treasure on treasure island, frost? My character knew she was looking for treasure, so when I saw a place to target, I decided that my PC would interact with it because it makes sense that treasure could be in the ground. I clicked on it to represent my character interacting (digging). It turns out treasure was there. There was a clear, IC, thought process behind it. I don't necessarily agree with Stabby overall on the clicking issue, but I don't think this argument holds weight. If it was just a matter of finding a spot and digging, your character could literally spend months and maybe years digging all over the island and not find all the hidden caches of treasure there. |
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Post by Pedantry INC on May 29, 2014 6:57:38 GMT -5
Though this is getting a bit off topic, I've always assumed the 'treasure map' has sort of... x marks the spots that gives your pc an idea of where to try digging.
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Post by StabbingNirvana on May 29, 2014 7:40:04 GMT -5
How did you find the treasure on treasure island, frost? My character knew she was looking for treasure, so when I saw a place to target, I decided that my PC would interact with it because it makes sense that treasure could be in the ground. I clicked on it to represent my character interacting (digging). It turns out treasure was there. There was a clear, IC, thought process behind it. You think that same process through each time you go there? |
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Post by Malignant Naricissism on May 29, 2014 7:44:24 GMT -5
My main issue is that Kelemvor has apparently decided to protect those few tombs, but not any of the many, many others filled with every kind of undead possible in Cormyr. Or do anything about oh you know, that one thing that lairs in that dungeon. Sort of something you'd think he'd be more keen on than protecting a couple of tombs.
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Post by Ivarcles on May 29, 2014 9:26:18 GMT -5
Though this is getting a bit off topic, I've always assumed the 'treasure map' has sort of... x marks the spots that gives your pc an idea of where to try digging. Give me a rough, crude map of an area the size of pirate island. Let me bury that many things in the area and mark the map with Xs. I very much doubt you'd be able to find all those areas in one day. It's not like the map is going to be something precise that was drawn up with surveyor's equipment. Even if you're digging in a spot five to ten feet away, you could very well miss a cache. X marks the spot isn't quite as simple as it might seem. Basically, as Stabby said, you know where the caches are because you hit TAB and they light up. |
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Post by Razgriz on May 29, 2014 9:55:37 GMT -5
Though this is getting a bit off topic, I've always assumed the 'treasure map' has sort of... x marks the spots that gives your pc an idea of where to try digging. Give me a rough, crude map of an area the size of pirate island. Let me bury that many things in the area and mark the map with Xs. I very much doubt you'd be able to find all those areas in one day. It's not like the map is going to be something precise that was drawn up with surveyor's equipment. Even if you're digging in a spot five to ten feet away, you could very well miss a cache. X marks the spot isn't quite as simple as it might seem. Basically, as Stabby said, you know where the caches are because you hit TAB and they light up. Pirate island should be played with search and spot rolls in my opinion. Im not saying that we are doing it wrong when we just click on the placeables that have the piles of gold, but maybe the dungeon should be modified so that finding the treasure feels more like finding it instead of just taking it. Maybe another tweak like needing a shovel for finding the treasure could be implemented as well. |
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Post by Pedantry INC on May 29, 2014 10:43:43 GMT -5
While in our RP we do struggle to maintain a fair bit of believability, we are also playing a fantasy game, and the purpose of playing is to have fun.
Fun factors into risk vrs reward, and treasure is one of our big rewards. Sometimes it's better to go with the adage 'keep it simple'. While I definitely agree with you Ivarcles, that it is quite an oversimplification of how finding treasure works, I err on the side that nwns mechanics can only go so far, and we have the basic tools provided to us (the map) to make the RP viable that, hey, the map hinted this area! So we dig around, mess around, play around, oh, here it is!
I also do like Mercs mention about spot/search. A server I sometimes play on when I feel like goofing around has treasure maps that drop that describe a location. If you can figure out where that is, you can move around the area. It actually uses search and lore ranks to see if you can find the treasure. The better the treasure, the higher the ranks required!
Again though this is still quite off topic, so I'm going to promise this is my last post about finding treasure unless someone wants to make a new thread <_< Sorry!
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Post by Lady Frost on May 29, 2014 12:57:57 GMT -5
My character knew she was looking for treasure, so when I saw a place to target, I decided that my PC would interact with it because it makes sense that treasure could be in the ground. I clicked on it to represent my character interacting (digging). It turns out treasure was there. There was a clear, IC, thought process behind it. I don't necessarily agree with Stabby overall on the clicking issue, but I don't think this argument holds weight. If it was just a matter of finding a spot and digging, your character could literally spend months and maybe years digging all over the island and not find all the hidden caches of treasure there. ..... That's your argument? While I have not pretended to dig in places without the glowing placeable, for treasure, admittedly, I -have- RP'd looking in crates, and other places that you can't actually loot. And I do try to make it realistic in that sense. That's not the point though. The point is that your character is making the decisions to do what you're making them do, not you. If you only loot placeables because they glow and avoid all the boxes that don't glow, who cares, it's a game. I'm not expecting you to RP digging 1000 holes, or RP at every crate in a dungeon. However, I would expect your PC to be making the decision to loot the crate that does glow though because /they/ want what's inside not because you as a player want it. Isn't that what we want: Characters making IC decisions? |
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2014 13:17:31 GMT -5
Ladyfrost, I think your point about the role playing side of things is well taken by everyone here. But there is also another side to this which one could call "game design." The two are separate issues. This thread raises both issues. Personally, I'm not exactly sure what skin it would be off your back, and I hope that phrasing doesn't come off as too blunt because I don't mean it to be, if the item that prompted this thread were altered. I don't *think* you're one of the builders here who would make that adjustment, though I stand corrected if you are, so it's not your time and energy spent if it gets changed. I'm pretty sure you wouldn't miss it for any reason, unless you'd explain what you think would be taken away. Etc. On the other hand, for others, it does apparently make more sense for them and add to the immersiveness and enjoyability of the game if the box in question were to be the subject of some adjustments. So, to my thinking, if some people (such as you) wouldn't really be affected because they have no real problems either way, while others would benefit, this says to me that from a whole-game and whole-community perspective, there's a net benefit to making an adjustment. Unless there's something I'm missing here, which I'm open to if I am, but ... this is how it looks to me. It seems to me that you're shooting down what to others could be a potential improvement to the game for them because you're personally not affected much by this issue either way. Again, unless there's something I'm not seeing, which I'm open to if there is.
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Post by StabbingNirvana on May 29, 2014 13:29:29 GMT -5
We know different containers are littered through out the server that reward the player AND the character for their efforts.
Those containers are the following but are not limited to:
Bones, coffins, cocoons, armor, weapons, crates, corpses, chests, boxes, holes, bags.
Several of those items give different options when activated:
Coffins: 1) stake vampire 2) spawn undead 3) loot
Holes: 1) use rope 2)spawn snakes 3) loot
Cocoons: 1) spawn spiders 2) loot
This is what we know through trial and error on playing the game. I'm sorry frost, but I call *bovine manure* on you thinking through every item you click on before doing it. Seriously, who the *bleep-itty-bleep* searches through cocoons or sticks their hands into random holes in the ground? We know it as players of the game that there's loot in there and we're gonna take it or that there may be a special option that will open. If you have to make up some lame RP excuse to justify that to yourself, well, you have my sympathies.
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Post by Lady Frost on May 29, 2014 14:05:35 GMT -5
My PC's don't always do those things. You'll never see Kherei put her hand in a hole in the ground. I don't loot everything. Sometimes I RP that my PC doesn't see a container, sometimes I chose that my PC wouldn't know you could get loot from something. Whatever the case, again, I don't loot everything, and the things I do loot my PC has decided to. It's not hard for me and it takes almost no time to consider. So, yes, every time.
"Lame RP excuses"? That's the entire point of the server.... to RP.
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Post by Lady Frost on May 29, 2014 14:17:00 GMT -5
Ladyfrost, I think your point about the role playing side of things is well taken by everyone here. But there is also another side to this which one could call "game design." The two are separate issues. This thread raises both issues. Personally, I'm not exactly sure what skin it would be off your back, and I hope that phrasing doesn't come off as too blunt because I don't mean it to be, if the item that prompted this thread were altered. I don't *think* you're one of the builders here who would make that adjustment, though I stand corrected if you are, so it's not your time and energy spent if it gets changed. I'm pretty sure you wouldn't miss it for any reason, unless you'd explain what you think would be taken away. Etc. On the other hand, for others, it does apparently make more sense for them and add to the immersiveness and enjoyability of the game if the box in question were to be the subject of some adjustments. So, to my thinking, if some people (such as you) wouldn't really be affected because they have no real problems either way, while others would benefit, this says to me that from a whole-game and whole-community perspective, there's a net benefit to making an adjustment. Unless there's something I'm missing here, which I'm open to if I am, but ... this is how it looks to me. It seems to me that you're shooting down what to others could be a potential improvement to the game for them because you're personally not affected much by this issue either way. Again, unless there's something I'm not seeing, which I'm open to if there is. I don't mind if anything is altered, I'm happy to alter it myself even. I'm just trying to explain that the OOC need to click on everything that glows is OOC and not IC. For example, I'm guessing that at least 75% of the people that pull the rope in the drow area that sounds the alarm first did it only because it glowed. That should be an IC decision not one based on it glowing. This is the exact reason I made the sword in the pedestal in Rivior's Keep. Even with a warning right on it, I knew players would have to click it. Entrapment? Maybe. Anyhow, like I said, I don't mind changing it. I even agree that some reasons for the change make sense. I'm debating against some of the reasons I don't agree with though. |
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2014 14:25:23 GMT -5
I don't mind if anything is altered, I'm happy to alter it myself even. I'm just trying to explain that the OOC need to click on everything that glows is OOC and not IC. For example, I'm guessing that at least 75% of the people that pull the rope in the drow area that sounds the alarm first did it only because it glowed. That should be an IC decision not one based on it glowing. This is the exact reason I made the sword in the pedestal in Rivior's Keep. Even with a warning right on it, I knew players would have to click it. Entrapment? Maybe. Anyhow, like I said, I don't mind changing it. I even agree that some reasons for the change make sense. I'm debating against some of the reasons I don't agree with though. Okay, I can see that. |
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Post by Ivarcles on May 29, 2014 15:11:19 GMT -5
I don't necessarily agree with Stabby overall on the clicking issue, but I don't think this argument holds weight. If it was just a matter of finding a spot and digging, your character could literally spend months and maybe years digging all over the island and not find all the hidden caches of treasure there. ..... That's your argument? While I have not pretended to dig in places without the glowing placeable, for treasure, admittedly, I -have- RP'd looking in crates, and other places that you can't actually loot. And I do try to make it realistic in that sense. That's not the point though. The point is that your character is making the decisions to do what you're making them do, not you. If you only loot placeables because they glow and avoid all the boxes that don't glow, who cares, it's a game. I'm not expecting you to RP digging 1000 holes, or RP at every crate in a dungeon. However, I would expect your PC to be making the decision to loot the crate that does glow though because /they/ want what's inside not because you as a player want it. Isn't that what we want: Characters making IC decisions? The point I was trying to make wasn't that we should all be RPing digging holes all over pirate island to find treasure. Rather, the fact that we don't would be an argument that would be in support of Stabby's "hit TAB, blue glow, me clicky" line of reasoning. Which I actually don't agree with (see underlined italics). But he does have a point. My own character used to not loot coffins and such in crypts. But then on a particular trip to the Necropolis, I realized (both IC and OOC) that it was kind of ridiculous that Cormyr, being a lawful good kingdom in which the creation of undead is illegal, allows a place like that to exist within its borders. I understand for whatever reasons, it being FR source(?), in game balance between good/evil, fun of having an epic dungeon to visit that it makes OOC sense to have it be there. But from an IC perspective, a kingdom like Cormyr probably ought to have sent the War Wizards and Purple Dragons in there ablazing and cleansed the place. So after realizing that, it became much less of an IC issue. Which also made things easier OOC because it would've been a drag having to have that conversation play out every time he travelled with somebody new to a crypt. Which would have been fine if he followed Kelemvor or something like that, because then it would have been high on his list of priorities and appropriate to constantly RP out. But he's not and it's not that high a priority for him. He has other things he's more concerned about so he concentrates on those and doesn't really fuss much about this any more. |
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Post by Lokarn on May 29, 2014 19:49:56 GMT -5
Okay, I have seen a few people mention that they have come to the conclusion IC and OOC that all these crypts are tainted, blah blah.
Have you guys considered the difficulty of a persistent world? Have you ever thought about what that means as far as your RP concerning going to a dungeon more than once? These places exist to give us players something to do. If they didn't exist, you would move to another server where they do exist.
I think too many people are forgetting that we have to suspend our disbelief in certain areas, such as why would Cormyr allow such a place to exist. If you changed your point of view so that you imagine each time your PC goes there it isn't the 200th time, but it is the first, or second, or third. You can better explain to yourself that Cormyr isn't allowing the place to exist, your group simply found it before it existed for very long, and you cleared the area.
YES, I understand this doesn't work logically. You have to "pretend" or... role play the idea, but you are not playing in a dynamic world where new areas are created each day, for each PC, that would be called Pen and Paper D&D. Here, you get a persistent world that has to cater to all possible players at all times, not just you.
If you don't want to have to deal with such trivial things as would my PC loot a grave, perhaps you need to lean back and consider if an RP server is right for you. The rule isn't "Remain in character for as long as you like." it's AT ALL TIMES. If you "can" be IC then you should be. FRC isn't an action server, or a social server, or a PvP arena server, it's a role play server, and that is what makes it what it is. We as players don't get the option to ignore the rules we don't like, we get two options, follow the rules to our best ability, or don't log in. If you wish to log in, follow the rules. Games have rules for a reason. ( yea, I lean LG in real life with CG streaks at times. )
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Post by StabbingNirvana on May 29, 2014 22:19:16 GMT -5
I would like to be in character at all times, but I'm going to need a DM to explain to me how I once found that chain mail on a stink beetle.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2014 22:19:27 GMT -5
Lokarn, forgive me, but I think some of us are overthinking this issue. I don't think pulling some loot out of a loot container that seems a lot like any other loot container in the game constitutes an action where we ought to rightfully be talking about violations of the rules. Rule breaks are things like ninja looting, constant running, griefing, and things like this. Not pulling all of 45 gold coins or what ever it is out of a box that *an argument can be made* that the character shouldn't have touched it. I think you're kind of pushing a little too hard in this one, at least with that last post. And if you want to pull in everything we should consider about the fact we're playing on a PW, then there are a lot of considerations to pull in that point in the other direction. Starting with the fact that clicking with a mouse is the only way to interact with anything in the game at all, including the act of putting the lid back *on* the box in question, if a character actually did in fact want to do that. I admire your dedication to the constancy and consistency of RP. But I think it would be good to kind of relax the grip a little bit for the benefit of the rest of us. |
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Post by Lokarn on May 29, 2014 22:36:59 GMT -5
I understand and accept that not everyone will agree with how I see the rules and guidelines of play. We will simply have to understand that we disagree on the issue. I don't believe I need to relax my stance on following the server rules however. My stance truly only ever affects myself. Well, it also affects others, in that I am always careful to keep them in mind when playing my bad PCs. I take great measures to ensure that I am not acting in a way that causes someone else to have a miserable time. I have chats with other prominent evils discussing how I can effectively play evil, without playing the stupid evil no one enjoys much.
That said, I feel like your biggest issue is that mark. So why not start a thread in ideas and suggestions detailing how you think the changes should be made on that script? I don't think this thread is for discussing game mechanics as much as I had planned it would be to discuss the role play of looting graves.
I still hold that looting graves is a terrible act, and should be something that has RP value. I understand some see looting as an ooc act, I disagree completely. If that was so, then robbing houses could be OOC as well, after all all you're doing there is looting. PC actions matter and I don't think how the dead are treated is a topic that should be ignored because it was glowing blue.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2014 22:53:21 GMT -5
I don't believe I need to relax my stance on following the server rules however. My stance truly only ever affects myself. Well, it also affects others, in that I am always careful to keep them in mind when playing my bad PCs. No, that's true, but I wasn't speaking of how you play your characters. I was speaking of holding everyone else to the same outlook here on this thread. I think it's also a big leap to liken playing a character to take loot from a grave to taking things from houses. My characters wouldn't even go into a house to loot it at all. Not so with undead infested crypts. Again, if you play your character that way, that's honestly probably a mark of a person who would provide quite an immersive experience to play with. If I were in the same dungeon with your character, and you were saying things IC about not touching certain graves, I'd go along with it. I'm just not really going to fault someone else if they play it a bit less seriously over this one. Anyways, I think I've said my piece on this one, I'm going to do my best to stay off this thread now. |
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Post by Extropy on May 30, 2014 1:30:36 GMT -5
I would like to be in character at all times, but I'm going to need a DM to explain to me how I once found that chain mail on a stink beetle. Bugs happen. We try to squash them out, but sometimes the chains of logic don't hold up. Inheriting the scripts from tons of other people I can also blame them  Bad puns aside, sometimes loot or other things might have a small issue. Try to roll with the punches and come up with something if you can - maybe the giant beetle swallowed a hin cleric whole with chain on? Maybe the chain wasn't inside the beetle ... it was just revealed to be a shiny object that the beetle was fascinated with & you couldn't loot it until after the battle, due the beetle being on top of it. |
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Post by StabbingNirvana on May 30, 2014 5:34:28 GMT -5
What about the spitting mosquitoes with the gold coins, extropy! This is totally breaking my immersion! How am I supposed to stay IC at all times if spitting mosquitoes have gold coins?!
Silly fun times aside, there's a point where you just have to recognize that the loot is set up in fractions, room by room, to reward the player for their progress. Whether it comes from a hole in the ground, or the loot happens to be a goblins sweaty jock strap. There has to be some logical suspension of IC at hand.
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Post by Ivarcles on May 30, 2014 19:14:20 GMT -5
Okay, I have seen a few people mention that they have come to the conclusion IC and OOC that all these crypts are tainted, blah blah. Have you guys considered the difficulty of a persistent world? Have you ever thought about what that means as far as your RP concerning going to a dungeon more than once? These places exist to give us players something to do. If they didn't exist, you would move to another server where they do exist. I think too many people are forgetting that we have to suspend our disbelief in certain areas, such as why would Cormyr allow such a place to exist. If you changed your point of view so that you imagine each time your PC goes there it isn't the 200th time, but it is the first, or second, or third. You can better explain to yourself that Cormyr isn't allowing the place to exist, your group simply found it before it existed for very long, and you cleared the area. YES, I understand this doesn't work logically. You have to "pretend" or... role play the idea, but you are not playing in a dynamic world where new areas are created each day, for each PC, that would be called Pen and Paper D&D. Here, you get a persistent world that has to cater to all possible players at all times, not just you. If you don't want to have to deal with such trivial things as would my PC loot a grave, perhaps you need to lean back and consider if an RP server is right for you. The rule isn't "Remain in character for as long as you like." it's AT ALL TIMES. If you "can" be IC then you should be. FRC isn't an action server, or a social server, or a PvP arena server, it's a role play server, and that is what makes it what it is. We as players don't get the option to ignore the rules we don't like, we get two options, follow the rules to our best ability, or don't log in. If you wish to log in, follow the rules. Games have rules for a reason. ( yea, I lean LG in real life with CG streaks at times. ) Alright, I'm going to talk about the Necropolis because that's what I referenced, and it's what made my character stop being concerned about the issue. First of all, there is no way you can go into that place and think that there is any sanctity of anything left. Any non-evil character of sane mind is going to walk away with that conclusion. And the Necropolis is absolutely known to the authorities. There are fallen guards of Arabel buried in the cemetary, presumably by the government after some battle or such. So they've got to know about the place. Plus it's called the Necropolis, meaning "City of the Dead". There's no hiding a place big enough to be called that. And there are guards stationed nearby and a merchant even, one that sells equipment for fighting undead. So people absolutely know about this place and that it's rotten evil to the core. Anyone still burying people there should probably be arrested for assisting in the creation of undead. Seriously. So yes, there's quite a bit of an issue with this whole graverobbing thing and how Cormyr allows for a place like the Necropolis to exist. And I do understand the OOC reasons for it's existence. If you read my previous post, I mention them there. And as for breaking rules, there are no OOC rules on this subject. All the rules are IC so if a character does something that crosses the line IC, it should be dealt with IC. If your character sees someone doing something he/she feels is inappropriate or breaking the law, then go have him/her report it to the authorities in character. Don't go posting about it OOC on the forums because there is no OOC server rule regarding graverobbing. |
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Post by Lokarn on May 30, 2014 20:02:28 GMT -5
Okay, I have seen a few people mention that they have come to the conclusion IC and OOC that all these crypts are tainted, blah blah. Have you guys considered the difficulty of a persistent world? Have you ever thought about what that means as far as your RP concerning going to a dungeon more than once? These places exist to give us players something to do. If they didn't exist, you would move to another server where they do exist. I think too many people are forgetting that we have to suspend our disbelief in certain areas, such as why would Cormyr allow such a place to exist. If you changed your point of view so that you imagine each time your PC goes there it isn't the 200th time, but it is the first, or second, or third. You can better explain to yourself that Cormyr isn't allowing the place to exist, your group simply found it before it existed for very long, and you cleared the area. YES, I understand this doesn't work logically. You have to "pretend" or... role play the idea, but you are not playing in a dynamic world where new areas are created each day, for each PC, that would be called Pen and Paper D&D. Here, you get a persistent world that has to cater to all possible players at all times, not just you. If you don't want to have to deal with such trivial things as would my PC loot a grave, perhaps you need to lean back and consider if an RP server is right for you. The rule isn't "Remain in character for as long as you like." it's AT ALL TIMES. If you "can" be IC then you should be. FRC isn't an action server, or a social server, or a PvP arena server, it's a role play server, and that is what makes it what it is. We as players don't get the option to ignore the rules we don't like, we get two options, follow the rules to our best ability, or don't log in. If you wish to log in, follow the rules. Games have rules for a reason. ( yea, I lean LG in real life with CG streaks at times. ) Alright, I'm going to talk about the Necropolis because that's what I referenced, and it's what made my character stop being concerned about the issue. First of all, there is no way you can go into that place and think that there is any sanctity of anything left. Any non-evil character of sane mind is going to walk away with that conclusion. And the Necropolis is absolutely known to the authorities. There are fallen guards of Arabel buried in the cemetary, presumably by the government after some battle or such. So they've got to know about the place. Plus it's called the Necropolis, meaning "City of the Dead". There's no hiding a place big enough to be called that. And there are guards stationed nearby and a merchant even, one that sells equipment for fighting undead. So people absolutely know about this place and that it's rotten evil to the core. Anyone still burying people there should probably be arrested for assisting in the creation of undead. Seriously. So yes, there's quite a bit of an issue with this whole graverobbing thing and how Cormyr allows for a place like the Necropolis to exist. And I do understand the OOC reasons for it's existence. If you read my previous post, I mention them there. And as for breaking rules, there are no OOC rules on this subject. All the rules are IC so if a character does something that crosses the line IC, it should be dealt with IC. If your character sees someone doing something he/she feels is inappropriate or breaking the law, then go have him/her report it to the authorities in character. Don't go posting about it OOC on the forums because there is no OOC server rule regarding graverobbing. OK, The Necropolis is one crypt on the server where undead are readily found and it is easy to understand that they are being created by evil necromancers. The necromancer guild resides in the area in fact. It can be easily determined that this place is wrong. How does that justify looting all the graves on the server? I don't know why you raise the credibility of the area existing as a valid reason to ignore looting graves being grave robbing. I don't mean all graves either, just the ones that don't spawn undead, or have undead directly near them. Or if you prefer, graves that your PC did not see any undead climb out of. The game engine is limited, so I will stick to specifically -graves that never spawn undead, but are looted anyway-. More specifically on this statement: Which subject do you think my point is regarding? My point is that looting graves is an IC action, not an OOC action. You seem to me to be implying that I think the subject is about looting graves breaking some OOC rule, that is not the case at all. The issue I raise is about players considering looting graves an OOC act. "It glows blue, so I -have- to loot it, and my PC looting it is an OOC act because my PC doesn't rob graves even though they just did." Is that more clear to you now? As text can't convey tone read that sentence as if a professor was trying to help you comprehend a topic of study that may be difficult. So, to respond to your last sentence, I haven't. I never mentioned any OOC server rule about grave robbing. I'm mentioning the remain in character at all times rule, which does exist, and is an OOC rule. |
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Post by StabbingNirvana on May 30, 2014 20:13:33 GMT -5
Everytime I open a coffin, I only find items and no bodies.  |
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