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Post by DM Justicar - Creator of FRC on Jan 9, 2007 23:46:27 GMT -5
DM's are allowed to disagree just like everyone else and I am sorry if anyone feels that makes us look "really bad". The point of this discussion was to be constructive. Clearly you didn't get the memo or read the rules of the topic Soul'fien. I don't think it's constructive to say that a peeve of yours is about DM's who know "nothing" about D&D on our forums. I feel like you were trying to imply that we have DM's like this, which clearly isn't the case. I'm going to take the middle ground here. I believe that there needs to be a certain unity in the staff, or else players will get confused by DM's who each have their own rules. The DM sections of this forum have over 8,000 posts, so we clearly do this to a fairly large extent already. However, we are all people, and it is in our nature to disagree. That's how we make progress. It's the reason every DM has their own unique style. Remember, that we were all players before we were DM's, and that DMing is something we do for fun. I trust the "public eye" to bear this in mind when two DM's discuss doing the same thing in various ways. I believe most of the times a DM disagress on something in the public forum, is because it was something that was brought up by a player. In interest of a timely response, we try and answer these questions as best we can on our own -- If our ideas differ too much, we will take it back to the privacy of the DM thread and make a decision there. ~Gallin *Gives DM Gallin the diplomacy award* Very well said and I agree. I feel it is definitely human to disagree to arrive at a better conclusion. Sometimes discussion (and disagreement) breeds a new understanding. Otherwise I feel we would all addle along in our own minds and never get anywhere with anything. Come to think of it, isn't that the whole point of forums? So everyone can share opinions both dissenting and agreeing? I have played briefly on a couple of "forum-less" servers. I don't think our caliber of player belongs there.
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Post by Quadhund/Greenhouse on Jan 10, 2007 0:30:46 GMT -5
I disagree with you DM Gallin. I think the DM's always agree with one another. Like right now, I am agreeing with you that the DM's are allowed to disagree ... *head explodes but fingers keep typing*
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Post by DM Justicar - Creator of FRC on Jan 10, 2007 1:31:15 GMT -5
I disagree with you DM Gallin. I think the DM's always agree with one another. Like right now, I am agreeing with you that the DM's are allowed to disagree ... *head explodes but fingers keep typing* I disagree Greenie. DM's should never disagree though, wouldn't you agree? I remember this one post you made where you were absolutely wrong, but I agreed with you and the community publicly ridiculed me for days. So I am never, ever agreeing with you again.
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Post by Retired DM Gallin on Jan 10, 2007 1:34:45 GMT -5
At this rate, we'll end up hijacking the thread WITH the topic just as badly as anyone could hijack it AWAY from the topic...
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Post by DM Justicar - Creator of FRC on Jan 10, 2007 1:36:37 GMT -5
Same goes for you Gallin. I am never agreeing with you again either. Wait, did I say agree, I meant disagree. Argh! Damn these publicly discused topics, I am losing my sense of self! OK, back on topic.
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Post by Dachshund on Jan 10, 2007 2:06:50 GMT -5
OK, back on topic. I disagree.
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Post by Pookey on Jan 10, 2007 8:07:59 GMT -5
I totally agree with that.
Wait.... what?
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Post by canuckkane on Jan 10, 2007 11:14:19 GMT -5
I have not been on FRC for very long, (only a few months now), however in my time here I have found the DM's to be very helpful and usually very kind. This is not to say that I haven't been angry with one, (*cough* vrulo killed by raging eye orc *cough*), but, they did have a point and I learned... think that falls under the harsh lessons thing... ah well. Just wanted to say I think the DM's do an excellent job and that, (to my thinking anyway), the players that have a beef with the dm's tend to be the ones that do their best to annoy, irritate and otherwise anger said DM in question. Just my two cents (Canadian, so about .2 cents U.S.)
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Post by whitepawn01 on Jan 10, 2007 17:24:51 GMT -5
Right. Nolf's post got me thinking. The DMs here are pretty good at awarding xp for roleplay, definitely, but the idea that you could possibly advance in level merely by roleplaying seems like a good idea. Isabelle has advanced her almost 6 levels on FR Cormyr over nearly three months now solely on rp xp. It is hard, and I spend all my time rping, but it is also really really rewarding. Honestly, I don't even think about levels anymore when I'm interacting with characters, just how Isabelle relates to them and the experiences she's had with them before. I expect to spend a day or two, maybe three, between rp xp awards, and as Isabelle progresses I expect my level gain to slow even more dramatically. Maybe by the time the server ends and goes over to NWN 2 (if ever) Isabelle will be level 10! To confess something, I have never read the rulebook. I have never been picked up by the DM staff on anything I have done simply by following the rules of common sense and character empathy - putting yourself in your characters shoes. I just enjoy myself and enjoy getting to know the stories and creativity of the players around me. Often this means I will be sitting in Isinhold or Redmist by myself, hoping somebody will come along to rp with me because I cant think of *another* reason for isabelle to travel to go and find people. So please don't anyone even think of suggesting that there isn't anybody to rp with if you're without your usual crew or something.
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Post by Masterbard Alyster Darkharp on Jan 10, 2007 17:46:51 GMT -5
Hmm...my idea of roleplay with Isabelle is trying to make a good excuse to quit talking to her. But..to illustrate your point, even if you don't like someone IC, or don't jive with them....there is still roleplay opportunity there. I don't care for Isabelle much as a character (though I like pawnzilla just fine oocly), I have an IC basis for pretty much shunning her, but when the bullet hits the bone and we bump into each other, we do speak. I also had a bit of a dispute with Guldar recently, but it didn't stop us from exchanging words (a few choice ones on his part) when we did run across each other. Theres alot to be said for going outside your normal crew in roleplay, in fact..I don't even have a normal crew anymore since I became a merchant. I go out and kill monsters with others maybe once a week (thats a big maybe). I only kill pretty much whats along the road to redmist from isenhold as solo venture. Lesson of this rambling: Theres no reason for a rivalry if theres no roleplay..notably continuing roleplay to back it up. So just using the excuse 'theres no one on I like or know' to not roleplay isn't a real good excuse since if you don't know them, you never will without roleplay, and if you don't like them..all the more reason to interact so you can either reinforce why you don't like them, or..maybe eventually kind of like them....anyways...I am ranting here off topic as a response to whitepawn (henceforth known as pawnzilla), but I agree that if people got rewarded more, they might roleplay more and solo and kill monsters less. That being said..the DMs do a great job, but I do get a bummed out feeling when I roleplay all week and it seems like no one is watching.
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Post by soulfien on Jan 10, 2007 17:50:40 GMT -5
DM's are allowed to disagree just like everyone else and I am sorry if anyone feels that makes us look "really bad". The point of this discussion was to be constructive. Clearly you didn't get the memo or read the rules of the topic Soul'fien. I don't think it's constructive to say that a peeve of yours is about DM's who know "nothing" about D&D on our forums. I feel like you were trying to imply that we have DM's like this, which clearly isn't the case. I'm going to take the middle ground here. I believe that there needs to be a certain unity in the staff, or else players will get confused by DM's who each have their own rules. The DM sections of this forum have over 8,000 posts, so we clearly do this to a fairly large extent already. However, we are all people, and it is in our nature to disagree. That's how we make progress. It's the reason every DM has their own unique style. Remember, that we were all players before we were DM's, and that DMing is something we do for fun. I trust the "public eye" to bear this in mind when two DM's discuss doing the same thing in various ways. I believe most of the times a DM disagress on something in the public forum, is because it was something that was brought up by a player. In interest of a timely response, we try and answer these questions as best we can on our own -- If our ideas differ too much, we will take it back to the privacy of the DM thread and make a decision there. ~Gallin DM Gallen said it better than I did, but he's understanding what I meant.
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Post by ShadowCatJen on Jan 11, 2007 11:43:16 GMT -5
DM Gallin made one reference to how things are now that the server is passworded. I would sort of like to hear from the DMs that expressed frustration before as to how they think things are now?
Granted, the dinkwad factor more then likely has dropped off, but it's hard to tell for certain from the player's side if it's really that much of an improvement.
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Post by soulfien on Jan 11, 2007 13:09:10 GMT -5
the only downside to having a password is that most people won't see the server at all anymore. I for one always click the "Hide Password Protected Servers" button. So they'll be an overall drop in new people altogether. If they'd have had the password from the beginning then the DM's would have never had to put up with me
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Post by Pookey on Jan 11, 2007 13:09:56 GMT -5
From my perspective it is better. We still get new players, but they actually read the forums!
So overall, I'd say things are getting better from my experience so far.
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Post by Helgrin Granitesoul on Jan 11, 2007 16:56:22 GMT -5
The password doesnt have to be up forever.. Have it up for a couple weeks and then have it down for a week.. Kind of go on a scheudule of up/down..
That way you get a semi steady addition of new players but the dm's do not get burned out because of the constant large numbers coming in
*does a dance*
100.. 100.. Im proven.. In yer face Trader.. 100.. 100
*goes off into the distance dancing the funky chicken*
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Post by hexer on Jan 11, 2007 20:02:48 GMT -5
the only downside to having a password is that most people won't see the server at all anymore. I for one always click the "Hide Password Protected Servers" button. [/b]So they'll be an overall drop in new people altogether. If they'd have had the password from the beginning then the DM's would have never had to put up with me [/quote] Good point. Yep, I'm still all for the server being passworded.
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Post by Hackmaster on Jan 11, 2007 23:15:57 GMT -5
It has gotten better since the server was passworded, I am glad it has been done. This would block few RP types as many wish to do their homework before they enter a server anyways. As long as they have a way to get to the forums it will be fine. We have no shortage of players anyways and if we only gain 2 RP players per week on a good week I will be fine over 100 per week testing their limits and keeping all of our time concentrated on them instead of what we should be doing.
A good RP person or those trying to learn is what I like to see. Yeah there are a few action powergamers out there that really are willing to learn and open themselves up to new ideas...great but I would rather work with a couple a week that are trying then 20+ a day that are not. DM's simply do not have that kind of time to spend on so many even if all of them were open and willing to learn. I have spent several hours a day in the past on one person trying to help them learn, let alone 10+ with new ones coming in everyday so I am grateful for the password, it will truly pull the dedicated ones out from the passersby. I say long live the password heh
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Post by Lokarn on Jan 12, 2007 2:14:47 GMT -5
*Sly Grin* I'm glad the password is helping.... that way I don't have to feel like a dummy after pushing for it a few times... *Wipes sweat from brow* I am not sure if it was the password or some improvements to the mod but I also notice the old stability is back that makes me happy. I felt bad getting sneak attacks every hit until the monsters would die. Now they can kill me back.... wait..... err....*Scratches head*
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Post by ShadowCatJen on Jan 12, 2007 11:20:08 GMT -5
... I also notice the old stability is back ... This has a lot to do with the fact that the majority of people that now play direct connect like they're supposed to. Heck, if the dinkwad refugees were ignoring something simple like just walking through the inns and towns you -know- they completely ignored direct connect. It is good to know that the passwording has improved things on the DM side. Even had a little bit of DM interaction last night with some simple rain and Chrys nearly getting fried by lightning. ^_^ Very good to see again. Small simple stuff like that makes me feel all glowy about a place.
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Post by Talus on Jan 12, 2007 11:36:42 GMT -5
... I also notice the old stability is back ... This has a lot to do with the fact that the majority of people that now play direct connect like they're supposed to. Heck, if the dinkwad refugees were ignoring something simple like just walking through the inns and towns you -know- they completely ignored direct connect. It is good to know that the passwording has improved things on the DM side. Even had a little bit of DM interaction last night with some simple rain and Chrys nearly getting fried by lightning. ^_^ Very good to see again. Small simple stuff like that makes me feel all glowy about a place. I would say it has more to do with the amazing DM Justicar Thanks for all the blood, sweat and tears Justi. But yes Direct Connect helps.
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Post by ShadowCatJen on Jan 12, 2007 11:44:59 GMT -5
This has a lot to do with the fact that the majority of people that now play direct connect like they're supposed to. Heck, if the dinkwad refugees were ignoring something simple like just walking through the inns and towns you -know- they completely ignored direct connect. It is good to know that the passwording has improved things on the DM side. Even had a little bit of DM interaction last night with some simple rain and Chrys nearly getting fried by lightning. ^_^ Very good to see again. Small simple stuff like that makes me feel all glowy about a place. I would say it has more to do with the amazing DM Justicar Thanks for all the blood, sweat and tears Justi. But yes Direct Connect helps. This is very much true. Not trying to kiss up either. Not an easy thing trying to deduce what script or issue could be lagging a server. So, yeah, kudos to Justi and the script/building monkeys behind him. And on walking... now that we do have less folks running around everywhere, spawning tons of crap, and just looting/farming to gain that next level the server resources have far less taxing it. I even noticed just by last night that people were actually RPing heading out with a full groups or looking to go with a group. A very good sign.
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Panros
Old School
Sneak Attack - Reach out and touch someone.
Posts: 479
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Post by Panros on Jan 12, 2007 14:37:27 GMT -5
I RP my heart out. Goodness, I even forget what XP is at times. I literally have dozens of mini conversations with NPC's a day. I'll sit there and RP with others most of my days longer than I'm out and about bashing skulls.
As of late I have been wondering how come I'm not receiving any love from the DM's. Couldn't once in a while a DM possess an NPC and speak with me, or send me on a quest? It seems like I have to hang with the "right" players if I'm ever going to have the opportunity to see some DM action.
I think back and Torgeir has had little DM interaction, yet alone any interaction that was solely focused on him. The most he's ever garnered was a beat down by orogs and a beat down by the crazy high level orcs.
I'm not asking to be pampered by the affection of the DM's. I'm just wondering, when am I going to be one of those "right" players? Am I doing or not doing things that deem me undeserving? I'm sorry, this is slightly selfish of me... but dang man.
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Post by DM Justicar - Creator of FRC on Jan 12, 2007 14:56:34 GMT -5
I RP my heart out. Goodness, I even forget what XP is at times. I literally have dozens of mini conversations with NPC's a day. I'll sit there and RP with others most of my days longer than I'm out and about bashing skulls. As of late I have been wondering how come I'm not receiving any love from the DM's. Couldn't once in a while a DM possess an NPC and speak with me, or send me on a quest? It seems like I have to hang with the "right" players if I'm ever going to have the opportunity to see some DM action. I think back and Torgeir has had little DM interaction, yet alone any interaction that was solely focused on him. The most he's ever garnered was a beat down by orogs and a beat down by the crazy high level orcs. I'm not asking to be pampered by the affection of the DM's. I'm just wondering, when am I going to be one of those "right" players? Am I doing or not doing things that deem me undeserving? I'm sorry, this is slightly selfish of me... but dang man. I personally gave your party a 250 XP RP (that was rewarded to all party members) bonus like 3 days ago. I believe you were in the Hullack in a certain ruin returning something to a certain flying creature... um, remember now? So maybe you "are" one of those players and just don't realize it. We will reward RP whenever we see it as long as we see it. Your post makes it look like there is DM favoritism when in fact you were just rewarded. Otherwise it could be that a DM isn't on when you are every single time, or maybe they are busy with something, or maybe you just didn't see that you recieved a bonus. We try and divide our time as equally as possible among all players as best we are able.
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Post by Retired DM Gallin on Jan 12, 2007 14:58:43 GMT -5
I RP my heart out. Goodness, I even forget what XP is at times. I literally have dozens of mini conversations with NPC's a day. I'll sit there and RP with others most of my days longer than I'm out and about bashing skulls. As of late I have been wondering how come I'm not receiving any love from the DM's. Couldn't once in a while a DM possess an NPC and speak with me, or send me on a quest? It seems like I have to hang with the "right" players if I'm ever going to have the opportunity to see some DM action. I think back and Torgeir has had little DM interaction, yet alone any interaction that was solely focused on him. The most he's ever garnered was a beat down by orogs and a beat down by the crazy high level orcs. I'm not asking to be pampered by the affection of the DM's. I'm just wondering, when am I going to be one of those "right" players? Am I doing or not doing things that deem me undeserving? I'm sorry, this is slightly selfish of me... but dang man. Don't lose hope. A lot of DM interaction is really just the luck of the draw. Planned quests are a rare thing for me these days. If I stumbled into your RP, and I happen to be inspired with some quest or other, then I'll definitely drop the hook. If I see it, I will possess an NPC and respond to a player, but when there are very few DM's on and the players are spread out across the server, it just comes down to coincidence. I've seen your RP, and I've liked what I've seen. It's not that you aren't "right," simply that your straw hasn't come up yet. When we stop to interact with one or a group of PC's, it can take anywhere from 5 minutes to several hours, so we won't necessarily be able to get through every player in the time we spend online. Especially in the last few days, the DM's have been a bit more reluctant to start quests (at least I have), since the DMFI tools had been disabled. That was the reason I spent so much time on as my PC lately. I'm usually upset when people ask for special treatment (I actually had a player ask me to stand around and grant them RP XP the other day), but I would say this is a good place to post those concerns. ~Gallin
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Panros
Old School
Sneak Attack - Reach out and touch someone.
Posts: 479
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Post by Panros on Jan 12, 2007 15:07:29 GMT -5
Favoritism, no, that is not what I wanted to get at. I was thinking that maybe the people where doing things that I wasn't doing, or maybe I was doing the wrong things, to get or not get some attention is all.
I do remember the event you pointed out, honestly, I did not even know I was rewarded any experience. It was just a short conversation that only a few members of the party partook in.
I understand that there are a whole lot of players, and it's highly possible that I just seem to miss a DM when I log on or did not see any given bonus XP.
I'm not in it for the RP XP just for nodding to an NPC though. I would like to see more interaction from DM to player like the little faerie dragon conversation along with the occasional hey, can you go on a quest as a favor for me type of interaction. Heck, even the occasionally high level creatures spawn beat down is good.
I know you guys do your best. I just feel like I've been in the shadow of other players for a looooong time. I have given up on a DM helping Torgeir better his sword Foecleaver among some other things I was hoping a DM would overhear IG.
I'm all for an honest response, via this topic or a PM.
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Post by Hackmaster on Jan 12, 2007 22:58:17 GMT -5
We do not want to miss anyone and if we could we would make sure the entire server had a blast the whole time but we cannot. We understand what you are trying to say though Panros and we have discussed this on the DM forums. We have noticed good players have managed to fly underneath the radar sort of speak. With so many players on this is something that unfortunately happens. We don't do it on purpose but we are wanting to make a conscious effort on trying to stop it regardless. We know you are all out there, and we try to get to everyone. Now that the lag is over, the server is not filled with action based players thanks to the password, and the DMFI is working again the DM's will start spending time up in the DM plane trying to make things fun with interaction. So hang in there Panros it will pick up again. Splitting time up between our characters we play ourselves, real life, and DMing makes sometimes for a small window of interaction and at times we get up there and just try to look for something interesting and exciting and run with it. We want to have fun while on as DM as well and not stare at a screen following a player around casually talking about their latest IC love troubles. Just to award them some RP XP. Most of us like to jump into a NPC and make them come to life but we have to catch such a thing going on and it be more then just a player saying something like "Hey Bentin...is this rain ever gunna stop or what?" I think most players can assume and imagine Bentin is gunna grumble and agree the rain sucks. Sometimes we will answer such idle chatter anyways but that assumes we don't have 15 other things on our plate at the time. Keep on trucking Panros, your time will come when we are there at the right time and making your life miserable
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Post by Munroe on Jan 12, 2007 23:20:20 GMT -5
That, and possessing Bentin usually means getting stuck playing Bentin for sometimes 30 minutes to an hour.
Playing guards is one of my least favourite things to do though. I'm always happy when Heimdall is around to play a guard for me when I'm running something. Partly because I have no idea what a guard would do.
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Post by thehunter123 on Jan 14, 2007 4:27:09 GMT -5
um .. started to write something .. but totally changed my views .. *snaps his fingers* that fast .. heh ..
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Post by DM Grizwald on Jan 14, 2007 12:43:16 GMT -5
I just want to throw this out there but dm interaction all kind of balances out. You might go a while without getting any then BAM you'll get loads for a while.
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Post by marklar on Jan 14, 2007 14:37:46 GMT -5
I just want to throw this out there but dm interaction all kind of balances out. You might go a while without getting any then BAM you'll get loads for a while. coulnd't agree more clarke, once you start you don't stop getting some really. if the DMs see that you are Rping often they'll look and see what you are doing. i've had periods where i've got none then others where i got thousands of XP in a few days. trust me when i say that whether you are good or evil you will get the same treatment.
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