big time death

[moulinous]

I have a question, when you are killed and killed good, like by a hell ball and die for negative 122 pts,lol, or a giant king gets four crits in a row and you go from 300 hps to negative 72, should you be able to raise dead? or would a resurecct spell be called for? that is big time death and a raise dead spell would seem to be able to raise a body that has been beaten on, but negative 70 or more seems like missing limbs, head, blah blah....just a question.

[Aodhan the Unusual]

Hee hee hee... Splat!

[Rill]

Baldur's Gate and core rules had the possibility of your party members being FUBAR'ed. If you're FUBAR, you'll not be resurrectable. Yeh?

[DM Grizwald]

It seems right to me. I know once Griz, my little hin, got dev critted by some undead drow and the rescue party gathered his body parts, placed them all together then raised him. But then again i dont rightly know the "true" power of a raise dead or the extent of how it should be worked

[moulinous]

so if you do become FUBAR, then, should a raise dead scroll work? maybe people could rp it like this? i dont know really, just food for thought more than a question now... what do you all think?

[SlothfulCat]

You couldnt bring back discintigrated companions in BG with raise dead...

essentially this by the handbook spell descriptions

Raise dead restores life, it doesn't necessarily close any wounds beyond what is needed to knock you back to 1 HP. So that gapping neckwound wil close up but that arm wont rea-attach.

Ressurection on the other hand restores you to full bodily health, so that cut off limb is re-attached, ressurection just needs some minor piece of the body to work... this is how respawning is plausible, the "healer" has some hair and/or blood etc and when you go missing gives ressurection a shot.

Important to note, that Ressurection wont regrow longtime losses... so if you lost a finger in childhood, being ressurected after you've turned fifty doesnt bring that finger back.


As far as a hellball goes... given the combination I'd say the body at -122 is probably completely destroyed... IE: discintigration... I'd say it depends on the order of the damage types and which one kills you.

However... its probably best to assume any blow ending a life isnt going to make someone un-raisible... farthest I've seen done was someone cutting off a head when all was said and done and punting Ranan's... oops!... ugly mug a few dozen yards away.

[Munroe]

avieupator said:

You couldnt bring back discintigrated companions in BG with raise dead...

essentially this by the handbook spell descriptions

Raise dead restores life, it doesn't necessarily close any wounds beyond what is needed to knock you back to 1 HP. So that gapping neckwound wil close up but that arm wont rea-attach.

Ressurection on the other hand restores you to full bodily health, so that cut off limb is re-attached, ressurection just needs some minor piece of the body to work... this is how respawning is plausible, the "healer" has some hair and/or blood etc and when you go missing gives ressurection a shot.

Important to note, that Ressurection wont regrow longtime losses... so if you lost a finger in childhood, being ressurected after you've turned fifty doesnt bring that finger back.


As far as a hellball goes... given the combination I'd say the body at -122 is probably completely destroyed... IE: discintigration... I'd say it depends on the order of the damage types and which one kills you.

However... its probably best to assume any blow ending a life isnt going to make someone un-raisible... farthest I've seen done was someone cutting off a head when all was said and done and punting Ranan's... oops!... ugly mug a few dozen yards away.

Resurrection actually requires that a part of the body that was part of the body at the time of death be used. So no leaving behind fingernail trimmings just in case you don't come home. The body part has to be part of the corpse at the time of death for it to work. If you're in prison and cut off a finger before your execution to be brought back by a co-hort later, that won't work. They would have to get the finger from the corpse after the execution.

True Resurrection (a level 9 cleric spell) will resurrect someone without even part of the body. It only requires that you clearly identify who you are trying to Resurrect.

No raise dead or resurrection spell can raise someone who has died of old age. Raise Dead will work up to 1 day/level after the person died, Resurrection and True Resurrection work 10 years/level after someone died.

No one can ever be brought back to life against their will. The soul always has the option of declining being restored to life. By the spell descriptions the soul is also aware of the alignment of the person attempting to bring him/her back to life.

[Theramin]

Two words; Wish Spells. You can't ressurect people who have been, for example, disintegrated, but it is possible to 'wish' them back to life. I'm not sure whether they have to be willing or not in this case.

[HeatherRae]

xzamuel said:

Two words; Wish Spells. You can't ressurect people who have been, for example, disintegrated, but it is possible to 'wish' them back to life. I'm not sure whether they have to be willing or not in this case.

If the spell is mimicking the lower-level spell, then it has to abide by the restrictions of said spell.

[Theramin]

Well, most of the spell descriptions that make characters un-raisable often say 'The character can only be brought back to life via a Miracle or Wish spell' so I've always assumed they override such things.

Then again in the game Wish et al are heavily dependant on DM involvement, something you can't get in NWN.

[Booze Hound]

xzamuel said:

DM involvement, something you can't get in NWN.

*ahem* unless of course you are playing FRC!

[SlothfulCat]

Thanks for the clarification Munroe, next time I should just dig the handbook out of where-ever it wound up first

[spacecowboy16739]

Just adding to what Munroe's already said, in case y'all care. Main reason I'm posting these is to give those casters of you who haven't played pen and paper games an idea of how magic is really supposed to work, and thus enhance your roleplaying experience. Just saying "...and I cast the spell..." isn't it. All the hand-waving and muttering and chanting and throwing bits of dragonsblood and burning incense is IMPORTANT........... Unless you're a sorcerer, of course. In which case, you just blink at the poor bastard and his head explodes. *grin*

PHB pg. 268
Raise Dead
Conjuration (Healing)
Level: Clr 5
Components: V, S, M, DF
Casting Time: 1 minute
Range: Touch
Target: Dead creature touched
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: None; see text
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)

You restore life to a deceased creature. You can raise a creature that has been dead for no longer than one day per caster level. In addition, the subject's soul must be free and willing to return (see Bringing Back the Dead, page 171). If the subject's soul is not willing to return, the spell does not work; therefore, as subject that wants to return receives no saving throw.
Coming back from the dead is an ordeal. The subject of the spell loses one level (or 1 Hit Die) when it is raised, just as if it had lost a level or a Hit Die to an energy-draining creature. If the subject is 1st level, it loses 2 points of Constitution instead (if this would reduce its Con to 0 or less, it can't be raised). This level/HD loss or Constitution loss cannot be repaired by any means. A character who died with spells prepared has a 50% chance of losing any given spell upon being raised, in addition to losing spells for losing a level. A spellcasting creature that doesn't prepare spells (such as a sorcerer) has a 50% chance of losing any given unused spell slot as if it had been used to cast a spell, in addition to losing spell slots for losing a level.
A raised creature has a number of hit points equal to its current Hit Dice. Any ability scores damaged to 0 are raised to 1. Normal poison and normal disease are cured in the process of raising the subject, but magical diseases and curses are not undone. While the spell closes mortal wounds and repairs lethal damage of most kinds, the body of the creature to be raised must be whole. Otherwise, missing parts are still missing when the creature is brought back to life. None of the dead creature's equipment or possessions are affected in any way by this spell.
A creature who has been turned into an undead creature or killed by a death effect can't be raised by this spell. Constructs, elementals, outsiders, and undead creatures can't be raised. The spell cannot bring back a creature that has died of old age.
Material Component: Diamonds worth a total of at least 5,000 gp.

PHB pg. 272
Resurrection
Conjuration (Healing)
Level: Clr 7
Casting Time: 10 minutes

This spell functions like raise dead, except that you are able to restore life and complete strength to any deceased creature. So long as some small portion of the creature's body still exists, it can be resurrected, but the portion receiving the spell must have been part of the creature's body at the time of death. (The remains of a creature hit by a disintegrate spell count as a small portion of its body.) The creature can have been dead no longer than 10 years per caster level.
Upon completion of the spell, the creature is immediately restored to full hit points, vigor, and health, with no loss of prepared spells. However, the subject loses one level, or 2 points of Constitution is the subject was 1st level. (If this reduction would bring its Con to 0 or lower, it can't be resurrected). This level loss or Constitution loss cannnot be repaired by any means.
You can resurrect someone killed by a death effect or someone who has been turned into an undead creature and then destroyed. You cannot resurrect someone who has died of old age. Constructs, elementals, outsiders, and undead creatures can't be resurrected.
Material Component: A sprinkle of holy water and diamonds worth a total of at least 10,000 gp.

PHB pg. 296
True Resurrection
Conjuration (Healing)
Level: Clr 9
Casting Time: 10 minutes
This spell functions like raise dead, except that you can resurrect a creature that has been dead for as long as 10 years per caster level. This spell can even bring back creatures whose bodies have been destroyed, provided that you unambiguously identify the deceased in some fashion (reciting the deceased's time and place of birth or death is the most common method).
Upon completion of the spell, the creature is immediately restored to full hit points, vigor, and health, with no loss of level (or Constitution points) or prepared spells.
You can revive someone killed by a death effect or someone who has been turned into an undead creature and then destroyed. This spell can also resurrect elementals or outsiders, but it can't resurrect constructs or undead creatures.
Even true resurrection can't restore to life a creature who has died of old age.
Material Component: A sprinkle of holy water and diamonds worth a total of at least 25,000 gp.

***

Oh, and yeah. In case you haven't noticed, in pen and paper, magic is a very expensive hobby: material components are always completely consumed in the casting of the spell.