|
|
Post by moulinous on Jun 27, 2007 20:36:36 GMT -5
excellent rant....
|
|
|
|
Post by HeatherRae on Jun 27, 2007 22:45:37 GMT -5
I'm so there with you.
What's really irritating is when the healers - of which I play one - react to the sight of such a badly wounded person in town and try to help, but are rebuffed - sometimes violently. It's very frustrating.
If you're Badly Wounded or Near Death, you should be wanting medical attention, not pitching a fit that someone *dared* say something to you about your condition.
Sometimes Isinhold feels like an episode of the Twilight Zone, I swear...
|
|
|
|
Post by DM Justicar - Creator of FRC on Jun 27, 2007 22:50:04 GMT -5
I know this has been discussed in the past, but after a few recent encounters in town and watching a few pc's standing in town chatting, obviously "badly wounded" or in a near death state, I thought maybe it should be revisited. Personally I don't buy the "it's not my blood" argument, but maybe that's just me. That particular game mechanic is one of the few things that is obviously visible to other pc's about your character. I think someone being badly wounded or worse isnt just some blood on your armor, you look obviously wounded to anyone who cares to look. Moving around should be difficult, and the last thing on your mind should be standing around talking about current events. Come on folks, lets be somewhat realistic here. You're back in town and the adrenaline rush that got your half dead body through the fight is gone now. Yes, but it isn't... It's yet another flaw in another flawed mechanic. The unfortunate part is there is no good way around it. While it may be in bad RP form to play it otherwise, it isn't specifically addressed in the rules. In a perfect world everyone would act exactly how you liked. I got over that a long time ago.  |
|
|
|
Post by SlothfulCat on Jun 27, 2007 23:38:09 GMT -5
My only thought here is I know a few PCs who like to RP out healing up the natural way now and then... or who emote that their wounds are bandaged and tended... while at an injured state... just not magically healed.
So something along the lines of a guy in a neckbrace chatting about current events.. instead of a guy holding his guts in chatting.
|
|
|
|
Post by Theramin on Jun 28, 2007 10:06:52 GMT -5
You have a point but I think what Justicar was getting at is that even in D'n'D itself, there's no mechanic for having less hitpoints. At 1hp you're still just as nible, active, radiant, etc. as you are at 8000. I think this might be why some people don't 'play it out'.
|
|
|
|
Post by Grozer on Jun 28, 2007 12:10:33 GMT -5
I know this has been discussed in the past, but after a few recent encounters in town and watching a few pc's standing in town chatting, obviously "badly wounded" or in a near death state, I thought maybe it should be revisited. Personally I don't buy the "it's not my blood" argument, but maybe that's just me. That particular game mechanic is one of the few things that is obviously visible to other pc's about your character. I think someone being badly wounded or worse isnt just some blood on your armor, you look obviously wounded to anyone who cares to look. Moving around should be difficult, and the last thing on your mind should be standing around talking about current events. Come on folks, lets be somewhat realistic here. You're back in town and the adrenaline rush that got your half dead body through the fight is gone now. That's my rant for the day. Other perspectives and realistic points of view as always are appreciated. I added the bold because I respectfully disagree with that comment. A wise man once said, ok I am talking about DM Laurk but whatever (trying to be humorous), that indicator is a reflection of your fatigue that once down to 'zero' you have no hope of defending against the killing blow. I mean think of it this way a mid to high level PC encounters a couple of hostile purple dragon knights trying to mug him alongside the road so a fight ensues (come on you know you want to laugh). They go at it round after round trading hits, you know that because you 'see' the damage... but is that realistic? I mean when its done after like 10-20 stabs/slashes (depending on the PC hitpoints) what do you really think the dead guy looks like? More realistic, in my opinion, would be a series of parried blows, 'maybe' a light cut or two and then a killing blow. You know think of your first level character who is killed by a single kobold in one round? This also helps you better explain 'heal kits' and such as they are used to restore energy. I mean I never have known many bandages that cure an injury as soon as they are applied. In short, I dont see the indicator as absolutely visible to my character. To me its a measure of weaken my opponent has become and thus soon presenting an opening for the final kill. |
|
|
|
Post by Masterbard Alyster Darkharp on Jun 28, 2007 12:17:01 GMT -5
I agree with this 100% Grozer, I have always thought of it this way to help explain why in DnD a character is 'Just Fine' untill he/she reaches 0 hp.
|
|
|
|
Post by TermaForever on Jun 28, 2007 12:55:38 GMT -5
Well I know for me, here is how I see it.
Uninjured Characters are just that. They are obviously lightweight pansies who haven't seen any real danger ;D
Barely Injured is the guy who look like he might have worked up a sweat, or if it looks like he hasn't been out recently maybe he has some cuts and scrapes that are healing up.
Once Injured roles around, at least with me, is when its time to seek a bit of intention. To me this is the guy who looks a bit sweat, maybe has a few visible dings in his armor and shield, a bit bruised but nothing to bad, but obviously becoming a bit winded.
Badly Wounded: This is when Rhondra starts breaking out the Cure Light Wounds on strangers. Blood is visible, the amount being up to the player but maybe its an ugly wound on a not so vital part of the body or a light wound on something important. And if they don't have active Adrenaline, they are gonna look a bit messed.
Near Death: Sit down, shut up, and let me heal you before your head comes all the way off. Nuff said.
Anyway thats how I look at it...least thats how I deal with it with my own characters.
|
|
Rill
New Member
fy fa'n...
Posts: 16
|
Post by Rill on Jun 28, 2007 13:28:15 GMT -5
Another point that's worth mentioning, leading up to the "What is HP?"-clarification, is the point of what a damage roll is worth. Being hit for 2hp if you're a level 1 elven sorceror with 8 constitution, you practically leaned down on the blade -- whereas with a dwarven barbarian of level 20, it'd be just about as significant as having blinked twice in the same second.
|
|
|
|
Post by sneakingyoda on Jun 28, 2007 13:36:30 GMT -5
|
|
Panros
Old School
Sneak Attack - Reach out and touch someone.
Posts: 479
|
Post by Panros on Jun 28, 2007 13:50:26 GMT -5
It's really not that complicated in my eyes, seeing as the lack of HP, whatever that might really be to a person, is summarized by uninjured, badly wounded, near death, etc.
If the game says you are badly wounded then act badly wounded. You are the role player and get to dictate what exactly is causing you to be badly wounded.
|
|
|
|
Post by catmage on Jun 28, 2007 18:24:06 GMT -5
The HP as dodging/parrying thing never worked for me, because of the Armor and Natural armor AC types. Natural armor works because your skin/hide/scales are thick enough that they absorb the impact of an attack. As well, there are attacks like a Red Dragons  , that unless you have evasion or immunity to fire, are going to hit you. Finally, in PnP, hp is on several occasions directly tied to blood and breaking the skin, as demonstrated by classes such as the Blood Magus (Complete Arcane, page 26) With the exception of near death status, I try not to pay attention to the floating status indicator unless I was a witness to the battle that caused that status. People change clothes, bandage wounds, cover burns, and the like, and even with "badly wounded", you don't know if he's one hit point from injured from being blasted by negative energy, which doesn't always leave visible wounds, or one hp from near death caused because a green dragon spat a cloud of chlorine gas on the poor schmuck. Lastly, the reasons healers might be rebuffed are numerous. For healing by casters, if you don't have spell craft ranks, odds are low you can tell the difference between Heal and Harm until the blast of light from the heavens smacks you on the head, for good or ill. From healing kits, whether you play them like bandages or like topical salve, you're stepping into the other characters personal space, often without true permission on the part of a stranger. Third, there are deities that teach taking responsibility for ones "failures", and so a character who doesn't want healing might be a militant follower of such a god. In the end, it's about the concept of personal space, which is very important in a world where touch spells, contact poisons, and just the plain old knife in the back are very real concerns. There's my opinion, afternoon chaps. |
|
|
|
Post by moulinous on Jun 28, 2007 20:47:43 GMT -5
not usre who i agree with. i use the same thing grozer does but i remember the time torian once again got it in the leg when out with me and Helgrin and started limping from an arrow. we patched her up but she still limped the whole time. good rp. now, i treat the heal kits as a magic salve due to the main reason from being a paramedic way back when, i never slapped a bandage on a guy and he said, awesome, arm feels great, lets go after he was near death from having it severed. Not sure how to rp this and maybe something the dms should discuss before frc2? what would be the appropiate way to rp not dying but being hurt? and it would hafta work for dungeon crawls and town....i know that when guldar gets hurt, no biggie, when squillion got hurt, he would limp. 20 con vs 10 con was the way i looked at it.*shrugs*
|
|
trebarruna
New Member
"There are some ideas so wrong that only a very intelligent person could believe in them. "
Posts: 83
|
Post by trebarruna on Jun 29, 2007 5:18:38 GMT -5
You know think of your first level character who is killed by a single kobold in one round? Heh, I remember my first level character who got killed with a single blow by a rat... beat that!  Been playing this game since it came out, and about the health issue, when a character gets wounded, I have seen peeps rp their condition with emotes like -coughs and spits some blood on the ground- *darn that one got me good!*, and i have seen peeps who just keep with the killing. *shrugs* I just play and do my part rp'ing the way i like, those with me chose if they want to play along or if they dont. Simple as that. |
|
|
|
Post by Grozer on Jun 29, 2007 12:53:52 GMT -5
not usre who i agree with. i use the same thing grozer does but i remember the time torian once again got it in the leg when out with me and Helgrin and started limping from an arrow. we patched her up but she still limped the whole time. good rp. now, i treat the heal kits as a magic salve due to the main reason from being a paramedic way back when, i never slapped a bandage on a guy and he said, awesome, arm feels great, lets go after he was near death from having it severed. Not sure how to rp this and maybe something the dms should discuss before frc2? what would be the appropiate way to rp not dying but being hurt? and it would hafta work for dungeon crawls and town....i know that when guldar gets hurt, no biggie, when squillion got hurt, he would limp. 20 con vs 10 con was the way i looked at it.*shrugs* My point is not that you dont RP the occasional ''arrow in the leg" when you are 'injured', its fun to do that every so often... just IN MY OPINION (catch that part?) if you do THAT everytime you are injured and such it really doesnt make sense for me. Can you imagine how many injuried the typical adventurer would incur if that were the case? For me, just seems unrealistic is all. |
|
|
|
Post by TermaForever on Jun 29, 2007 13:14:33 GMT -5
I rp injuries by the situation. When Adelius was killed by an Ogre Elite near Suzail, I RP-ed a giant dent in his helmet. When Aria blasted him with a fireball by mistake, he was burned. When the giant killed me as someone killed it, he was smushed under the falling giant. Usually, if its just injured, he doesn't even realize he's hurt till down the road he notices the pain in his side just won't go away...
I think this is one of those things people just have to make thier own style for...simple like that.
|
|
|
|
Post by SlothfulCat on Jun 29, 2007 18:21:08 GMT -5
Who said it was a mistake?
|
|
|
|
Post by HeatherRae on Jun 30, 2007 3:05:46 GMT -5
Yeah, uh... It was deliberate.  |
|
|
|
Post by TermaForever on Jun 30, 2007 16:45:24 GMT -5
The time i was thinking was a mistake. Other times it was on purpose that is true.
|
|
, that unless you have evasion or immunity to fire, are going to hit you. Finally, in PnP, hp is on several occasions directly tied to blood and breaking the skin, as demonstrated by classes such as the Blood Magus (Complete Arcane, page 26)
