|
Post by grivel on Feb 1, 2018 18:02:04 GMT -5
I think being an outlaw brings a bit of status to the character. Manus has only had one PVP with an evil and that was with Nethramirth (sp?). It didn't go too well for her. So when I met up with Abii near the Arabel orcs, it was intriguing. She was wearing a helm and gave a different name, so I treated her just like another adventurer I would meet on the road. We parted ways with Manus inviting her to stop by the bakery sometime. It was very well played on her part and could have gone either way.
|
|
|
Post by nemusator on Feb 2, 2018 5:49:59 GMT -5
I'm glad nobody is forced to be permanently dead or retire from playing. As for me I think outlaws spice the things up. Whether you try to detect them, hunt them down, or just avoid them, it gives plenty of opportunities for good RP. Personally i really enjoyed interactions I had recently with Abii, and with Darius some time ago.
As long as everything is done by the rules and nobody is grieved I see no problems or need to change anything.
Sure, FRC strives to make things the most realistic possible but still fun. The most important thing is to balance it so everyone can have theirs.
|
|
Abii
~
Banned
Posts: 273
|
Post by Abii on Feb 2, 2018 19:48:15 GMT -5
Idk why you guys are talking about Aris. I wasn’t. From who like who but I did't ever thought that You woudl say such things about me. Honestly i even felt bad with it...I asked few players that Im RPing with from I don't know ? I guess from my begining, they helped a lot with their comments to this, more over im reciveing a lot of OOC tells that it's great that Abii is here- it's really nice to hear that, even that we are on the other side of barricade, not to mention friends but even PC/players that I never met/ or even talked before LOL. I thinks this is only your own opinion. Did I make mass PVP ? In my eyes the only PvP I started was with Dimitri player (Im not happy with this now cuz my reason was worse that weak, sorry Dimitri!) Did I powerlevel ? Tho actually gaining mass levels in short peroid of time is called Powergaming, I woudl say... maybe ? The main rule is to have fun but without hurting others. It's wrong that I had best fun in adventuring or if many will call it dungeon grinding, even if I did it with the rules ? Ofcourse i did many mistakes, like all the time running... Woah, long time ago it was nightmare for me to walk all the time, now I rarely run on my PC and I even enjoy it. Stupid ? But it's true. I brought a lot more that this about what You are talking about me, that's not my personal opinion... That's opinion of many players that I won't type here. If You don't see it, then maybe Your person didn't brought nothing except PVP to Abii ? Think about it from my side of medallion. Beside that dude, I still like You, can you feel it ? *here is big heart* I know this is not excuse but consider that this is my first RP game, Im still learning and trying my best to put RP above everything, before I came here I was a Hack n Slash/Mass Pvp/Powergammer player. Maybe I did wrong that I chosed to play a Villian, but well... Dices were thrown and you have to live with it
|
|
|
Post by Syd's Blue Sky on Feb 3, 2018 4:16:32 GMT -5
If you leveled Abii up to deep epics and killed a buncha people eight years ago and then retired, people would be talking about you in those threads where they say how much they miss so-and-so, and tspeak in respectful whispers about how terrifying you were.
You haven't powerleveled any faster than the average person around here. In fact, you probably level about on average with people. Most of them just make alts and have four epics instead of one really epic. As for PvP? I've seen you demonstrate way more restraint and class and sportsmanship than most people here.
Haters gonna hate.
|
|
|
Post by lucid on Feb 3, 2018 8:23:28 GMT -5
Part and parcel to the reward was the impact you had. PVP rampage does not really count, I thought I made that clear. There is some difference in opinion out there in what constitutes such behavior but that's a different topic. I don't see why any further support is needed for characters that have lived out a reasonable (sometimes highly unreasonable) arcs. Because now they have to start as level 1 again and slog through the boring stuff. This will produce level 50 good guys, since they never get reset, and level 20 bad guys, who only stand a chance against noobs. And before you tell me that level doesn't matter, you yourself told me to take a hike until I was high enough level to matter. It's all very well and good for you to say Story Above All but there is exactly zero chance that Mara is taking a dive for some nobody scrubass. Without the mechanical power to back up the threat, you will not treat someone as a threat, period. So yes I think they should get a boost to get back up there again and yes I think they should be rewarded for taking the time to do something interesting.
|
|
|
Post by bloodalchemist on Feb 3, 2018 11:20:18 GMT -5
Oooook, I'm not gonna derail things by responding to the...many grievances in that reply, feel free to send me a pm if you wanna talk about where exactly you got the "story above all", "telling you to take a hike." As well, I don't engage in pvp on mara for the exact reason that I don't feel like putting her into circumstances where I feel permadeathing would be appropriate. Anyways, feel free with the PM.
|
|
|
Post by Orchid on Feb 3, 2018 12:33:18 GMT -5
I think some people in this this thread, and to lesser degree the majority of the relevant(active and contribute to the community) players on the server as a whole have this idea that outlaws are villains. You can be outlaw without being a villain. You can be a villain without being an outlaw. Someone who put enough time, RP, planning and networking in place could conceivably do both. It's possible, and I wait with baited breath the day it happens if for no other reason than to see who implodes ooc because they can't RP their way around it IC and who stays the course and fair plays it out. It'll be glorious however it plays out. People can argue til the cows come home about what a jerk Ecthedel is, justify your ooc issues all you like. Same with Abii. I admittedly haven't been following Abii's shenanigans as much as I did Darius's so I'll give people some benefit of doubt. Regardless of your opinion, they created RP en masse. You don't have to like them, player or character. Noone is saying you do. That does not alter the fact they in essence unified and polarized most of the relevant server population in a way that in my time here I've not seen a DM or plot do. All of this with no guaranteed loot, xp, or any reward whatsoever, AND the very real possibility of eating a respawn and in some cases losing MONTHS of xp work.
I don't know Abii all that well. I traveled with Darius however, pre and post outlaw. I personally orchestrated the chain of events that led to the DM sanctioned and approved and run murdering of Triadic squires while Darius was in jail. Only two people IC know about this. That entire thing was blamed on Darius and noone, not once, has ever even hinted or questioned around me or the character involved who started that. I did zero PvP in that whole thing. Did not attack nor hostile anyone. In fact, my only PvP ever in relation to Darius was Shiv gank killing Jabari in the middle of GG. I had witnesses, I had screenshots sent to me, I had all the evidence I needed to haul Shiv in to the Ravens. I never did. Full disclosure: Are Shiv and I friends oocly? Absolutely. Is that relevant? Not one bit. IC is IC, ooc, is ooc. The two do not mix ever.
TL;DR You can perpetrate some really dastardly evil and pull over some really messed up server RP and be a truly crafty villain without without any PvP at all. You can 100% be an outlaw without being villain. You can 100% be a villain without being an outlaw.
|
|
|
Post by sergeil on Feb 4, 2018 2:20:36 GMT -5
Abii say:
>> In my eyes the only PvP I started >> sorry Dimitri!)
Only one PvP and outcast for life? It there way to cancel for Abii outlaw status? If world in game is realistic, everybody, who has committed a misconduct must be able to return to normal life ...
I was on level, maybe, 6, when some strange low-level character hit me in GG near INN. My character react and hit him back. My sword was secured and I hit him by hand. But it was enough to cause serious damage. Of course, I have stopped it and left GG to avoid conflict.
But I was able to kill him easy... Outlaw?
|
|
|
Post by Animayhem on Feb 4, 2018 2:55:26 GMT -5
Abii say: >> In my eyes the only PvP I started >> sorry Dimitri!) Only one PvP and outcast for life? It there way to cancel for Abii outlaw status? If world in game is realistic, everybody, who has committed a misconduct must be able to return to normal life ... I was on level, maybe, 6, when some strange low-level character hit me in GG near INN. My character react and hit him back. My sword was secured and I hit him by hand. But it was enough to cause serious damage. Of course, I have stopped it and left GG to avoid conflict. But I was able to kill him easy... Outlaw? No. That on PVP started a chain of events and lead to other PVP by her and the result of her actions. This link explains: Outlaws
|
|
|
Post by sergeil on Feb 4, 2018 4:21:38 GMT -5
Abii say: >> In my eyes the only PvP I started >> sorry Dimitri!) Only one PvP and outcast for life? It there way to cancel for Abii outlaw status? If world in game is realistic, everybody, who has committed a misconduct must be able to return to normal life ... No. That on PVP started a chain of events and lead to other PVP by her and the result of her actions. This link explains: OutlawsYes, it was really very bad thing, but it was year ago. Time is gone and, maybe, not a lot of players still angre about. Is there standard way for character to leave crime life and return to standard gameplay or character became out of law for forever? Of course, it can be hard and expensive way and only player's wish is to accept it or not.
|
|
|
Post by StabbingNirvana on Feb 4, 2018 9:43:21 GMT -5
I think some people in this this thread, and to lesser degree the majority of the relevant(active and contribute to the community) players on the server as a whole have this idea that outlaws are villains. You can be outlaw without being a villain. You can be a villain without being an outlaw. Someone who put enough time, RP, planning and networking in place could conceivably do both. It's possible, and I wait with baited breath the day it happens if for no other reason than to see who implodes ooc because they can't RP their way around it IC and who stays the course and fair plays it out. It'll be glorious however it plays out. People can argue til the cows come home about what a jerk Ecthedel is, justify your ooc issues all you like. Same with Abii. I admittedly haven't been following Abii's shenanigans as much as I did Darius's so I'll give people some benefit of doubt. Regardless of your opinion, they created RP en masse. You don't have to like them, player or character. Noone is saying you do. That does not alter the fact they in essence unified and polarized most of the relevant server population in a way that in my time here I've not seen a DM or plot do. All of this with no guaranteed loot, xp, or any reward whatsoever, AND the very real possibility of eating a respawn and in some cases losing MONTHS of xp work. I don't know Abii all that well. I traveled with Darius however, pre and post outlaw. I personally orchestrated the chain of events that led to the DM sanctioned and approved and run murdering of Triadic squires while Darius was in jail. Only two people IC know about this. That entire thing was blamed on Darius and noone, not once, has ever even hinted or questioned around me or the character involved who started that. I did zero PvP in that whole thing. Did not attack nor hostile anyone. In fact, my only PvP ever in relation to Darius was Shiv gank killing Jabari in the middle of GG. I had witnesses, I had screenshots sent to me, I had all the evidence I needed to haul Shiv in to the Ravens. I never did. Full disclosure: Are Shiv and I friends oocly? Absolutely. Is that relevant? Not one bit. IC is IC, ooc, is ooc. The two do not mix ever. TL;DR You can perpetrate some really dastardly evil and pull over some really messed up server RP and be a truly crafty villain without without any PvP at all. You can 100% be an outlaw without being villain. You can 100% be a villain without being an outlaw. I'm not sure what most of this post is trying to say exactly but in relation to the Triadic squires that were getting killed on a regular basis, I will say that there was a list of I want to say around 5 people that we had known as supporting Darius and attempted doing our own investigations on because we were offered no DM support in the form of Purple Dragon's/War Wizards attempting to fulfill justice. One of my complaints that fell on deaf ears was that the Triad guild was being used at the expense of evil/enemy PCs to elevate themselves by being able to successfully raid a castle by their lonesome made our institution look overwhelmingly weak. As leader I was never offered any information about keep attack events so that we could organize a proper defense of the keep. To top it off, there was never any attempt in the aftermath to even give any Crown support other than a "we grieve with you and we'll bring justice to the perpetrators". These attacks would happen so often that on the guild forum I had to set up an NPC guard response on how to react to aggressions against the keep but realistically they weren't followed by DMs because a) it wasn't read by the DM's taking part in these events and b) it took a lot of effort to actually have each NPC squire do things that wasn't automated in such a scenario. Which is alright in and of itself. But then also having other events used to conceal the identities of the keep attackers and diminish any sort of competence by trained mountain castle guards were created. I don't have my notes since I no longer have access to the guild forum, but off memory in relation to the Darius attacks, none of our guards saw anything. No one in Eveningstar saw anything and none of the guards recalled anyone passing through their gates heading up to the Triad keep. There was too much snow. All we had to work off of was a note and arrows in our guards. There was no further support to even attempt to get the perpetrators or investigate the attack offered to us by DMs. These "DM sanctioned and approved" attacks on the Triad keep while I was leader without any communication to give us an actual attempt to defend either during the attack or take down the attackers in the aftermath through lawful investigation is highly disappointing. This type of stuff wouldn't happen with Ash Island and it shouldn't. You could argue that Ash Island is on it's own island and that's why this stuff wouldn't happen but the Triad keep is on a snow capped mountain peak that has trained soldiers for the terrain and it's defense. It's really a shame that there was so much incompetence attributed to the guild NPCs during my time as leader in an effort to shadow the identities of the attackers. If this was a one off thing, I'd say fine. This has happened around 5 or 6 times now, the latest being with Abii to the point where we had to block off all access to the Triad's lands and have extra gates put in place along the bridge to slow down any possible new attackers on their exit. TLDR: Darius wasn't blamed alone for attacks at least not on my end. All characters involved were protected by DMs. The murders of the squires were never attributed to Darius alone nor was justice found for those squires. The ball started rolling against Darius when he killed Shiv and a warrant was issued for him.
|
|
|
Post by Animayhem on Feb 4, 2018 11:58:27 GMT -5
No. That on PVP started a chain of events and lead to other PVP by her and the result of her actions. This link explains: OutlawsYes, it was really very bad thing, but it was year ago. Time is gone and, maybe, not a lot of players still angre about. Is there standard way for character to leave crime life and return to standard gameplay or character became out of law for forever? Of course, it can be hard and expensive way and only player's wish is to accept it or not. As it stands in general once an outlaw an outlaw for life. As for the reversal I suppose rp would have to be approved and properly acted out. This naturally would need to be sanctioned by dm's. The outlaw issue is still a very sensitive subject to some and there is still frustration and anger at it and the whole PVP system.
|
|
|
Post by Orchid on Feb 4, 2018 12:51:56 GMT -5
I think some people in this this thread, and to lesser degree the majority of the relevant(active and contribute to the community) players on the server as a whole have this idea that outlaws are villains. You can be outlaw without being a villain. You can be a villain without being an outlaw. Someone who put enough time, RP, planning and networking in place could conceivably do both. It's possible, and I wait with baited breath the day it happens if for no other reason than to see who implodes ooc because they can't RP their way around it IC and who stays the course and fair plays it out. It'll be glorious however it plays out. People can argue til the cows come home about what a jerk Ecthedel is, justify your ooc issues all you like. Same with Abii. I admittedly haven't been following Abii's shenanigans as much as I did Darius's so I'll give people some benefit of doubt. Regardless of your opinion, they created RP en masse. You don't have to like them, player or character. Noone is saying you do. That does not alter the fact they in essence unified and polarized most of the relevant server population in a way that in my time here I've not seen a DM or plot do. All of this with no guaranteed loot, xp, or any reward whatsoever, AND the very real possibility of eating a respawn and in some cases losing MONTHS of xp work. I don't know Abii all that well. I traveled with Darius however, pre and post outlaw. I personally orchestrated the chain of events that led to the DM sanctioned and approved and run murdering of Triadic squires while Darius was in jail. Only two people IC know about this. That entire thing was blamed on Darius and noone, not once, has ever even hinted or questioned around me or the character involved who started that. I did zero PvP in that whole thing. Did not attack nor hostile anyone. In fact, my only PvP ever in relation to Darius was Shiv gank killing Jabari in the middle of GG. I had witnesses, I had screenshots sent to me, I had all the evidence I needed to haul Shiv in to the Ravens. I never did. Full disclosure: Are Shiv and I friends oocly? Absolutely. Is that relevant? Not one bit. IC is IC, ooc, is ooc. The two do not mix ever. TL;DR You can perpetrate some really dastardly evil and pull over some really messed up server RP and be a truly crafty villain without without any PvP at all. You can 100% be an outlaw without being villain. You can 100% be a villain without being an outlaw. I'm not sure what most of this post is trying to say exactly but in relation to the Triadic squires that were getting killed on a regular basis, I will say that there was a list of I want to say around 5 people that we had known as supporting Darius and attempted doing our own investigations on because we were offered no DM support in the form of Purple Dragon's/War Wizards attempting to fulfill justice. One of my complaints that fell on deaf ears was that the Triad guild was being used at the expense of evil/enemy PCs to elevate themselves by being able to successfully raid a castle by their lonesome made our institution look overwhelmingly weak. As leader I was never offered any information about keep attack events so that we could organize a proper defense of the keep. To top it off, there was never any attempt in the aftermath to even give any Crown support other than a "we grieve with you and we'll bring justice to the perpetrators". These attacks would happen so often that on the guild forum I had to set up an NPC guard response on how to react to aggressions against the keep but realistically they weren't followed by DMs because a) it wasn't read by the DM's taking part in these events and b) it took a lot of effort to actually have each NPC squire do things that wasn't automated in such a scenario. Which is alright in and of itself. But then also having other events used to conceal the identities of the keep attackers and diminish any sort of competence by trained mountain castle guards were created. I don't have my notes since I no longer have access to the guild forum, but off memory in relation to the Darius attacks, none of our guards saw anything. No one in Eveningstar saw anything and none of the guards recalled anyone passing through their gates heading up to the Triad keep. There was too much snow. All we had to work off of was a note and arrows in our guards. There was no further support to even attempt to get the perpetrators or investigate the attack offered to us by DMs. These "DM sanctioned and approved" attacks on the Triad keep while I was leader without any communication to give us an actual attempt to defend either during the attack or take down the attackers in the aftermath through lawful investigation is highly disappointing. This type of stuff wouldn't happen with Ash Island and it shouldn't. You could argue that Ash Island is on it's own island and that's why this stuff wouldn't happen but the Triad keep is on a snow capped mountain peak that has trained soldiers for the terrain and it's defense. It's really a shame that there was so much incompetence attributed to the guild NPCs during my time as leader in an effort to shadow the identities of the attackers. If this was a one off thing, I'd say fine. This has happened around 5 or 6 times now, the latest being with Abii to the point where we had to block off all access to the Triad's lands and have extra gates put in place along the bridge to slow down any possible new attackers on their exit. TLDR: Darius wasn't blamed alone for attacks at least not on my end. All characters involved were protected by DMs. The murders of the squires were never attributed to Darius alone nor was justice found for those squires. The ball started rolling against Darius when he killed Shiv and a warrant was issued for him. I dunno what all else happened, I omly know the one I had a hand in hand. had nothing to do with elevating anyone. I suggested it ICly as retaliation to the threats Triad made regarding Darius if he was let out/escaped. I wasn't privvy to how it all went down or the oversight, I was just the catalyst. My whole point was, you can do villainous things and incite havok without resorting to banal PVP.
|
|
|
Post by FORSETIS on Feb 4, 2018 19:55:51 GMT -5
Idk why you guys are talking about Aris. I wasn’t. From who like who but I did't ever thought that You woudl say such things about me. Honestly i even felt bad with it...I asked few players that Im RPing with from I don't know ? I guess from my begining, they helped a lot with their comments to this, more over im reciveing a lot of OOC tells that it's great that Abii is here- it's really nice to hear that, even that we are on the other side of barricade, not to mention friends but even PC/players that I never met/ or even talked before LOL. I thinks this is only your own opinion. Did I make mass PVP ? In my eyes the only PvP I started was with Dimitri player (Im not happy with this now cuz my reason was worse that weak, sorry Dimitri!) Did I powerlevel ? Tho actually gaining mass levels in short peroid of time is called Powergaming, I woudl say... maybe ? The main rule is to have fun but without hurting others. It's wrong that I had best fun in adventuring or if many will call it dungeon grinding, even if I did it with the rules ? Ofcourse i did many mistakes, like all the time running... Woah, long time ago it was nightmare for me to walk all the time, now I rarely run on my PC and I even enjoy it. Stupid ? But it's true. I brought a lot more that this about what You are talking about me, that's not my personal opinion... That's opinion of many players that I won't type here. If You don't see it, then maybe Your person didn't brought nothing except PVP to Abii ? Think about it from my side of medallion. Beside that dude, I still like You, can you feel it ? *here is big heart* I know this is not excuse but consider that this is my first RP game, Im still learning and trying my best to put RP above everything, before I came here I was a Hack n Slash/Mass Pvp/Powergammer player. Maybe I did wrong that I chosed to play a Villian, but well... Dices were thrown and you have to live with it Lol. Cute. The amount of fake people on this server is getting exhausting.
|
|
|
Post by Razgriz on Feb 4, 2018 20:43:16 GMT -5
I think the thread has run its course.
Outlaw status is boring, but there is nothing better right now and yes, it is needed.
Hopefully soon things will improve little by little.
|
|
Fenix
~
Sleepless Golem, aka Kenny
If you read this, send me a love note.
Posts: 2,183
|
Post by Fenix on Feb 4, 2018 21:06:17 GMT -5
Abii say: >> In my eyes the only PvP I started >> sorry Dimitri!) Only one PvP and outcast for life? It there way to cancel for Abii outlaw status? If world in game is realistic, everybody, who has committed a misconduct must be able to return to normal life ... I was on level, maybe, 6, when some strange low-level character hit me in GG near INN. My character react and hit him back. My sword was secured and I hit him by hand. But it was enough to cause serious damage. Of course, I have stopped it and left GG to avoid conflict. But I was able to kill him easy... Outlaw? I mean there was the whole mass slaughter of greatgaunt, a respawn, and the repeat of it literally minutes later. But the dms said that didnt happen.
|
|
|
Post by StabbingNirvana on Feb 4, 2018 21:54:38 GMT -5
The entire creation of the outlaw status was to, in corporate speak, "manage them out". There's a reason why the characters on the list are Aris, Neth, Abii, and Darius. These characters were engaging in mass PvP player gankings. The havoc that Orchid is speaking about regarding becoming an outlaw via other means just won't happen. That's why I was referring to the squire kills earlier. No on cared about them other than the Triad people. The DM's didn't care about them. The moment players started complaining about getting killed over and over and over again by these outlaw PCs though is when action had to start being taken. Becoming an outlaw is meant an IC and OOC punishment to curb the behavior. The DM's won't tell you that, but it is. That's why Shiv isn't an outlaw while being a murderer. It's because he does his murders little by little over a long period of time. He didn't go on mass killing sprees in a short period. His entire basis of play isn't PvP focused like that of Neth, Darius, and Abii. These three characters in particular became server problems. Hence they were outlawed. Think of it as a mini-ban.
On a lighter note, I can't blame you or anyone else for attacking our NPC squires. I wouldn't want to engage a team who's PvP record was 100-1 in the several years while the guild was around.
|
|
Fenix
~
Sleepless Golem, aka Kenny
If you read this, send me a love note.
Posts: 2,183
|
Post by Fenix on Feb 4, 2018 22:51:35 GMT -5
The entire creation of the outlaw status was to, in corporate speak, "manage them out". There's a reason why the characters on the list are Aris, Neth, Abii, and Darius. These characters were engaging in mass PvP player gankings. The havoc that Orchid is speaking about regarding becoming an outlaw via other means just won't happen. That's why I was referring to the squire kills earlier. No on cared about them other than the Triad people. The DM's didn't care about them. The moment players started complaining about getting killed over and over and over again by these outlaw PCs though is when action had to start being taken. Becoming an outlaw is meant an IC and OOC punishment to curb the behavior. The DM's won't tell you that, but it is. That's why Shiv isn't an outlaw while being a murderer. It's because he does his murders little by little over a long period of time. He didn't go on mass killing sprees in a short period. His entire basis of play isn't PvP focused like that of Neth, Darius, and Abii. These three characters in particular became server problems. Hence they were outlawed. Think of it as a mini-ban. On a lighter note, I can't blame you or anyone else for attacking our NPC squires. I wouldn't want to engage a team who's PvP record was 100-1 in the several years while the guild was around. This is u
|
|
|
Post by StabbingNirvana on Feb 4, 2018 23:07:20 GMT -5
I am pretty great. Won't lie.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2018 23:27:45 GMT -5
Darius didn't like being insulted to his face. Still doesn't.
|
|
|
Post by Asgardian Grey Hawk on Feb 4, 2018 23:51:55 GMT -5
Darius didn't like being insulted to his face. Still doesn't. same with Aris.
|
|
Fenix
~
Sleepless Golem, aka Kenny
If you read this, send me a love note.
Posts: 2,183
|
Post by Fenix on Feb 5, 2018 0:20:29 GMT -5
Please see my previous post.
|
|
|
Post by StabbingNirvana on Feb 5, 2018 0:34:23 GMT -5
Fenix, please see your previous post.
|
|
|
Post by Extropy on Feb 5, 2018 0:58:45 GMT -5
I think this has run the course for now. Thank you all for the input!
|
|