DM Q&A Champion of XYZ

[appleseedy]

An inquiry about the COT prestige class

I'm interested in the prestige class and how the DM team perceives the class to function.

My own thoughts on the class would be that the champion would espouse the ideas and concepts of the faith/church they are a follower off. Which for certain faiths seems to be a little different from being a militant branch of whichever church.

Example a champion of say tempus would perhaps be leading the line, focused on martial excellence....obvious really? you would also expect them to be talking about bravery and so on

a champion of Liira (if that even makes sense) would be focused on very different activities? for example organising festivals/events and would focus on artistic activities around dance and performance?

You know why i'm asking and i'm not trying to be smart, just asking for clarification and thoughts

[Syd's Blue Sky]

It's a martial class on the par with a fighter for the HD, prof, BAB and feats. Regardless of the god, it would seem to me to make sense that they would be bringing this martial approach to the table. I'd expect a CoL to be an active and militant force for the church, a sword arm, nearly a paladin without the code in their approach.

I see nothing martial at all about organizing festivals focusing on artistic activities.

[Munroe]

What Syds said.

Even a divine champion of a peace-loving deity is still representative of a martial branch of that faith. The champion is being granted Sacred Defense (+1 to all saves every 2 levels), Lay on Hands, Smite Evil, and eventually Divine Wrath from his or her deity, all of which are combat-focused divine blessings.

In order to enter the class, the character has to have a +7 BAB and Weapon Focus in a melee weapon. Entering the class also grants light and medium armor proficiency, shield proficiency, and proficiency with all simple and martial weapons. These are not blessings from the deity, but things the character learns to use as he or she becomes a divine champion. As Syds said, the class is a full BAB class (+1 BAB every non-epic level), and a d10 hitdice class. The Champion of Torm class also grants access to a combat feat (from the fighter list) every two levels, with the exception of Weapon Specialization, the fighter-exclusive feat.

Champion of Torm is a divine combat class with some of the perks of the paladin class (Lay on Hands, Smite Evil), but mechanically closer to fighter than paladin due to the feat progression. No matter what deity the character is a champion of, the divine champion still trained as a combatant to become a champion and progress as one.

Even a divine champion of Eldath, the goddess of peace, would be a combat-focused character by nature of the class. Such a character might focus on defensive feats and protecting others through a strong defense, and might not engage enemies directly, but rather let them engage him/her, or put him/herself between enemies and allies, but the character would still be a warrior by training and continued class progression.

When not in combat, a champion of Eldath or Lliira, or Sune, or whatever, would do as others of that faith do, of course. An Eldathan would live peacefully, a Lliiran would throw or attend festivals, a Sunite would foster love and friendship, etc., but that isn't because the character is a divine champion, it's because that character is a devoted member of the faith. All those things would be things a member of that faith does, and, having been granted divine power (Lay on Hands, Sacred Defense, etc.) by the god(dess), the character is likely very devoted to the faith and participates in things that faith does. Those things, however, are part of being faithful, not part of being a divine champion.

A character who is a divine champion of a peace-loving faith is a warrior by training though, and would still be the first one to strap on a sword belt when trouble arises. Such a character might be the one to wear the sword in peace-time anyway, to be ready for the coming trouble.

Anyway, the point is that divine champion is always a martial class, regardless of the deity worshiped. That can make for some interesting RP as a warrior has to reconcile being a warrior with his/her peace-loving ways.

As concerns Lliira specifically, she is a fun-loving deity, but even her faith has its warriors. The Scarlet Mummers come to mind.  They're the primary example of warriors that worship Lliira. 

Here's some information on the Scarlet Mummers, a militant branch of Lliira's faith (taken from a Realmslore web-article published on wizards.com in November 2006): archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rl/20061115a
The Scarlet Mummers by Ed Greenwood (except I cut-off the King Azoun narrative bookends):

Formed to avenge the murder of Lliira's High Revelmistress in Selgaunt, the Scarlet Mummers are a militant order within the Church of Joy.

Few in number and highly secretive, the Mummers hide among both clergy and the (purportedly) lay worshippers of Lliira. "Fierce Joy" is the phrase they use to reveal themselves to Lliiran priests, who both fear and revere them (and aid and obey them unhesitatingly). Some Mummers use red roses as 'calling cards' at the sites of their slayings and work and within temples and shrines of Lliira. Holding a single, cut rose has become a wordless signal of membership in the Mummers or a call for Mummers to rally to the holder of the rose and provide aid.

Founded to punish the clergy of Loviatar, the Mummers have swiftly expanded their role to protecting the faithful of Lliira at revel and more solemn worship. They defend Her holy places and kill those who slaughter and oppress Lliirans. From tyrannical officials and rival clergy who seek to stamp out revelry to Loviatans who have been instructed by higher clergy (or inspired by dreams sent by Loviatar herself) to work against the Church of Joy all have cause to fear the Mummers.

The Scarlet Mummers won't hesitate to hire adventurers and other mercenaries to aid them in guarding Lliiran temples, clergy, and worshippers and in attacking or withstanding strong enemy forces. They prefer to act personally and stealthily whenever possible, except when they reach an altar of Loviatar. There they like to dance (protected by the strongest magic they can raise), using their blade-boots (daggers that snap forth out of the soles, projecting beyond the toes) against all Loviatans who come against them.

Scarlet Mummers aren't grim killers. They love to sing, dance, revel, dally, play games, and entertain children -- but unlike most Lliirans, they are always alert for danger and ready to explode into action to deal with it.

The Scarlet Mummers got their name from the disguise used by the first Mummers to descend on Loviatans in Selgaunt. They posed as a traveling troupe of singing, dancing actors and performed right outside the gates of the Loviatan temple, attacking clergy of Loviatar who emerged with whips in hand to "see them off."

Mummers do not wear distinctive uniforms or cleave to formal titles or a specific hierarchy. Among Mummers, there's an informal hierarchy -- overridden by Lliira whenever she sees operational need -- based on merit (past performance as a Mummer). Most hold ranks within the church of the Joybringer, but their roles as Mummers supersede these ranks. When they "step into action" out of their usual duties, or go on missions, they may give orders to any Lliiran cleric, even High Revelmistresses, and expect to be obeyed. They almost always will be.

There are no false Scarlet Mummers. The goddess Lliira pays close personal attention to every Mummer and empowers those who meet other Mummers to be instantly aware and absolutely certain they're dealing with a Mummer operating with Lliira's full approval. By the same token, Lliira keeps close control over Mummers through dream-visions and voiced-in-their-heads answers to prayers and spontaneous warnings or words of guidance. She won't tolerate self-interest or Mummers who are straying from her service. Anyone who impersonates a Mummer will swiftly be plunged into quivering, helpless unconsciousness, mentally overwhelmed by rapturous joy sent by the goddess. They remain that way until they die of malnutrition, are imprisoned, hauled away for punishment, or ejected by Lliirans, their impersonation discovered.

Scarlet Mummers value precise work -- slaying, maiming, or wounding only those who have offended against Lliira or intend a threat against Lliirans, not everyone accompanying said sinners. Veteran Mummers recruit good-in-action Lliiran clergy or devout worshipers (that is, individuals who strongly revere Lliira, venerating her before all other deities) to become Mummers. They act as mentors and tutors to those recruits.

Most Mummers are lithe and athletic, even acrobatic, but Mummers can be of any class capable of devoutly worshipping Lliira.

[appleseedy]

thanks guys

[mandene]

This is what Players' Guide to Faerûn (a 3.5e) says about Divine Champions:

A divine champion is the strong right arm of her deity. She serves as a guardian of holy sites, a protector of pilgrims, and a leader of crusades. Though paladins fill these roles in many good-aligned churches, a divine champion can take up the banner of any deity, regardless of alignment or ethos [mandene's comment: Except for evil in NWN/FRC]. Rivalries between divine champions of opposing faiths have been the stuff of legends told by bards for centuries. These holy warriors are loved by their patron's worshipers and hated by the church's enemies in equal measure.

Forgotten Realms Campain Setting (3e) says something similar:

Divine champions are mighty warriors who dedicate themselves to their deity's cause, defending holy ground, destroying enemies of the church, and slaying mythical beasts and clerics of opposed faiths. For deities that do not count paladins among their followers, divine champions fill the role of the church-sponsored warrior.

The Player's Guide to Faerûn also presents this interesting sidebar:

Deific Grudge Matches

Although the opposed alignment system works just fine for determining a divine champion's enemies, there are many deities in Toril that, while not diametrically opposed in alignment, hate each other with a passion. The following table lists the most commonly worshiped gods of Faerûn and several of their enemies. Each divine champion should choose one foe of her patron deity to oppose. For deities not noted on this table, the DM can either choose an appropriate opposed deity or consult Faiths and Pantheons

Deity	Opposed Deities
Azuth	Cyric, Mask
Bane	Cyric, Helm, Ilmater, Lathander, Mystra, Oghma, Torm, Tyr
Chauntea	Auril, Malar, Talos, Umberlee
Cyric	Bane, Kelemvor, Mystra, Torm
Eilistraee	Drow pantheon (choose one)
Gond	Talos
Helm	Bane, Cyric, Malar, Talos
Ilmater	Cyric, Loviatar, Talona, Talos
Kelemvor	Cyric, Talona, Velsharoon
Kossuth	Istishia
Lathander	Bane, Cyric, Malar, Shar, Talos, Velsharoon
Lolth	Eilistraee, elven pantheon (pick one), Ghaunadaur, Gruumsh
Malar	Chauntea, Helm, Mielikki
Mask	Helm, Oghma, Torm, Selûne
Mielikki	Malar, Talos, Talona
Mystra	Bane, Cyric, Helm, Shar
Oghma	Bane, Cyric, Mask, Talos
Selûne	Mask, Shar, Umberlee
Shar	Lathander, Selûne, Shaundakul
Shaundakul	Beshaba, Shar
Silvanus	Malar, Talos, Talona
Sune	Auril, Malar, Talos, Talona, Umberlee
Talos	Chauntea, Helm, Ilmater, Lathander, Shaundakul, Silvanus
Tempus	Garagos
Torm	Bane, Cyric, Mask
Tymora	Bane, Beshaba, Loviatar
Tyr	Bane, Cyric, Mask, Talos, Talona
Umberlee	Chauntea, Selûne, Sune, Valkur
Uthgar	Auril, Helm, Ilmater, Malar, Torm, Tyr
Waukeen	Graz’zt, Mask